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I need some general advice/confirmations

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I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Rekzer » Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:26 am

I feel like my reforging/gemming/enchanting is a huge mess. Im seeing alot of druids not getting any hit/expertise and that's just unheard of to me as a former caster since Classic. I cant give up the hit/exp until 4.1 anyways since im usually on Interrupt duty. Im mostly seeking to make sure im doing things right, or where i can improve.

Im pulling ~20k dps reliably. We downed atramedes for the first right and i held around 19.4k there, and on Chim aroudn 21k.

Armory link:
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/c ... y/advanced

Maelstrom crystal enchants are ridiculously expensive right now(crystals are 4k+) so im using regulars. Any suggestions would be good as I'm terrible with the theorycrafting right now(feral is very new to me)

My basic rotation is;
Mangle(unless warrior is with us)
Rake
Shredding to 5
Rip
Redding to 5
Savage Roar
Shredding till either RIP or SR Drops and then doing either
Sub 25% Using Ferocious on 5 Combo pts and keeping dots up

Berserking depending on fight, ie on magmaw's head, or right away on atramedes to make best use of it.

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Leafkiller » Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:53 pm

On your rotation, the order is fine, but don't wait for 5 combo points to get your first Savage Roar up - do it after 1 combo point and then refresh it whenever it is about to drop regardless of combo points. There are many things you can do to fine tune your rotation to push out extra dps. These are captured in the Ovale script that is posted on this forum. For example, you make no mention of how you are handling Tiger's Fury in your basic rotation, nor feral charge/ravage - which play a role on several fights.

1. For gemming - agility should be everywhere. In your gear set the only place you should have a gem that is not pure agility is in your helm where you should have a 20 agi/20 hit gem. The only other gear piece I am aware of at this time where you are better off using a 20 agi/20 hit gem is the tier chest piece. In both cases it is due to the favorable socket bonus.

2. For reforging. Your number one stat is mastery. Never reforge away from mastery and always reforge to mastery if it is missing from a piece of gear.

3. After that your best two secondary stats are crit and haste - which work best when somewhat balanced.

4. Put 35 or 50 strength on your gloves. Strength is second to agility in terms of relative stat value and is significantly better than any other stat. Never sacrifice agility or strength for any secondary stat.

5. When you can afford the maelstrom crystals, put 50 agility on your bracers. Do this before you put +20 stats on your chest - it is larger dps increase.

6. Get some tier gear. Your 2 piece and 4 piece set bonuses are significant dps increases. Not to mention the chest piece you are using is particularly bad due to the way it is itemized (although this should be fixed in the 4.01 patch).

As I stated in point 3, crit and haste are you best secondary stats after mastery, however, with the changes to the 4.06 patch the difference in relative value between all of the secondary stats excluding mastery is pretty small. I recently swapped my reforging to get hit capped and ran some simulations in Mew which showed a 50dps loss, so it is viable to reforge and get hit capped without a significant impact to your dps - and it is possible to do so without violating points 1 and 2 above. It is not possible to get both expertise and hit capped, and you should not try to. Outside of Al'akir, hit is preferable just in case you need to do some interrupts.

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Rekzer » Thu Mar 03, 2011 5:14 pm

I redid my enchants and gems(still trying to find an enchanter with 50 Agi to bracer though)
Did a heroic and pulled 20k on a regular boss with no vulnerabilties, which is what i pulled in RAIDS before

I started blowing Savage Roar right away
Tigers fury - Im popping this to regenerate energy when im empty in order to spam shred, and pretty much on cooldown
I have a feral charge/ravage macro, i blow it at the start of a fight and whenever I can if theres movement and so on that separates me from the boss or if im switching targets.

Last thing im iffy about, is i currently spam TF + Berserk together, should I be separating these?

I reforged into mastery wherever i could, and sacrificed crit/haste for Hit to get hip called. Expertise is gone(minus bracer temporarily)

Im saving for tier pieces right now, only at 1600 Valor atm and were not progressed yet to bosses that drop Tier. With Daily heroics n such ill get 1 piece next week.

Thanks again, huge help!

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Leafkiller » Thu Mar 03, 2011 5:21 pm

Use TF as soon as possible on cooldown when your energy dips below 25-30. In general the best time to pop berserk is 1-2 abilities after you have cast TF - when your energy is in the 85-100 range (65-80 if TF has finished). Try not to pop Berserk at a point where it will delay your next TF (15 seconds before TF comes off of cooldown).

The reason I mentioned FC/ravage is that on some fights (Chimaron, Cho'gall, Valonia/Theralion) you can FC while in melee range whenever FC is off of cooldown. This provides a substantial dps increase on those fights.

Keep in mind that sacrificing crit/haste for hit is a small dps loss.

Don't forget you get a damage buff in an heroic if any of the spots are pugged.

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Rekzer » Thu Mar 03, 2011 5:49 pm

Leafkiller wrote:Use TF as soon as possible on cooldown when your energy dips below 25-30. In general the best time to pop berserk is 1-2 abilities after you have cast TF - when your energy is in the 85-100 range (65-80 if TF has finished). Try not to pop Berserk at a point where it will delay your next TF (15 seconds before TF comes off of cooldown).

The reason I mentioned FC/ravage is that on some fights (Chimaron, Cho'gall, Valonia/Theralion) you can FC while in melee range whenever FC is off of cooldown. This provides a substantial dps increase on those fights.

Keep in mind that sacrificing crit/haste for hit is a small dps loss.

Don't forget you get a damage buff in an heroic if any of the spots are pugged.


Ah thats true, we had 2 pugs

As for FC/Ravage, i had no idea that you could FC while in melee range..this is huge

Ill keep that in mind about TF

Last question

Come 4.1 with the interrupts not needing hit, will you be giving up hit also?

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Leafkiller » Thu Mar 03, 2011 7:16 pm

I noticed that you have 4 pieces of gear with no mastery on them (gloves, pants, boots and alchy trinket). Your first priority in reforging should always be to put mastery on an item if it is missing.

We are the worst interrupters of all melee at this time whether or not we are hit capped. I recently changed my reforging to be hit capped to test how much of a difference it made in the simulations to reforge that way. When 4.0 first came out, reforging for hit/expertise was huge dps loss. Now it is not so much (less than 50dps) and having a little extra hit/expertise makes the toon easier to play (fewer misses/dodges). When the dps difference is small enough, then quality of life solutions are more viable. For instance, when you are doing a lot of add switching and trying to get a mangle plus a few shreds on a target before it dies, the extra hit is helpful (poison protocol on Omnitron is a good example).

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby Rekzer » Thu Mar 03, 2011 11:30 pm

Leafkiller wrote:I noticed that you have 4 pieces of gear with no mastery on them (gloves, pants, boots and alchy trinket). Your first priority in reforging should always be to put mastery on an item if it is missing.

We are the worst interrupters of all melee at this time whether or not we are hit capped. I recently changed my reforging to be hit capped to test how much of a difference it made in the simulations to reforge that way. When 4.0 first came out, reforging for hit/expertise was huge dps loss. Now it is not so much (less than 50dps) and having a little extra hit/expertise makes the toon easier to play (fewer misses/dodges). When the dps difference is small enough, then quality of life solutions are more viable. For instance, when you are doing a lot of add switching and trying to get a mangle plus a few shreds on a target before it dies, the extra hit is helpful (poison protocol on Omnitron is a good example).


Hmm, those are the pieces i used to get myself hit capped. I definitely need that for now as my raid comp doesnt seem to have people who can reliable interrupt as well as me :(

I see your point though about trying to get mastery on every piece, so i played around a bit to maintain a hit cap and squeezed out some mastery.

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Re: I need some general advice/confirmations

Postby felhoof » Mon Mar 07, 2011 5:54 pm

Note that hit/expertise make a significantly larger overall average damage boost on targets that are going to die (or need to die) quickly compared to mastery or crit. With the disincentivization of combo points crit isn't as great as it once was (there's no need to get to a certain combo point income given how lame FB is) and mastery only helps bleeds which are not as special on shorter-duration adds.

A case study would be something like the raging spirits on LK - each needs to die in about 20 seconds. You ahve enough time for one set of bleeds and that's it, and every attack missed is one that simply can't be made up down the line in terms of damage output.

That isn't to say that hit or expertise are better than the other options, only that they have significant advantages outside of stand still fights - and one of the biggest ones is when there is less time on target.

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