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Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

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Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 4:52 am

Welcome to my Feral DPS Guide and FAQ! My goal is to provide most of the information a new player would need for starting as Feral, as well as providing details on some more commonly discussed advanced tactics. If you're here looking for an answer to a simple question, you're in the right place!

This guide is currently up to date for patch 5.4. If you have any questions or comments on the content provided in this guide, feel free to leave a post to let me know!
Still finishing a few of the sections of this guide, but all of the information currently in it should be accurate for the current patch (if you think it isn't, let me know).

Index
  1. Rotation
    • Which CP Generator to Use and When
    • Bleed Clipping
  2. Talents
  3. Glyphs
    • Recommended
    • Situational
  4. Gearing
    • Stat Priority and Reforging
    • Enchants
    • Gemming
    • Best in Slot
  5. Trinkets
    • High Item Level Trinkets
    • Low Item Level Trinkets
  6. Frequently Asked Questions
    • What's changed in patch 5.4?
    • When do I replace my Rune of Re-Origination?
    • Which trinket should I use? / Should I break my set bonus? etc.
    • How can I simulate my character?
Last edited by aggixx on Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:46 am, edited 42 times in total.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 4:52 am

 Rotation

Feral as a specialization almost entirely focuses on the application and maintenance of bleeds; that is, physical damage-over-time debuffs (DoTs). As such, your rotation primarily revolves around maintaining these debuffs so that they have the highest possible uptime, as well as overwriting these debuffs (when appropriate) so that they may deal the most damage at any given time.

As a Feral Druid, your goal is not to deal massive amounts of direct damage, in fact most of our direct damage abilities deal very poor damage and result in being a very small amount of our total damage breakdown. The vast majority of your direct damage will come from auto-attack, followed by Mangle and Shred, and then Ferocious Bite. That's right, you heard me, our 5 point direct damage finisher is one of the least prominent abilities in our damage breakdown, and as such, you may find that the rotation is designed to use any other finisher than Ferocious Bite when it's remotely feasible to do so.

This post will not be going into the exact conditions and priority under which you should use every single ability in your rotation, if you're interested in such a thing you should check out the SimulationCraft action list which is maintained by myself along with support of some other prominent ferals in the community. You can find the discussion thread for that action list here:
Simulationcraft - Feral rotation discussion and script

Instead, I will be providing a rough outline of the ideas behind the rotation; understanding why the action list above does what it does is very important to being able to adapt and think for yourself.

 What  When  Why
 Savage Roar  Any time Savage Roar is not up.  40% increase to all your damage, what is there to say? This should be
 up ALL of the time so you shouldn't have to apply savage roar more than a couple
 times a fight.
 Faerie Fire  Any time Weakened Armor is not
 up or is about to expire.
 Someone else in your group may be able to do this for you, but ferals
 are pretty good at it. Try to weave this in when you have downtime in your rotation.
 Tiger's Fury  Your energy is less than 35 and you
 do not have Omen of Clarity active.
 Tiger's Fury is a short but potent cooldown and you want to take
 advantage of every second of it. Try to make sure your energy is low when it's about to
 come off cooldown so you can use it as soon as possible. You may want to delay using this
 for AoE situations.
 Rip  The new Rip would be at least 15%
 stronger than your current.
 See the section on bleed clipping below.
 Ferocious Bite  The target has less than 25% health
 and you have Rip on the target.
 Thanks to one of the effects of Ferocious Bite, using it on a target
 that's below 25% health renews the current Rip on your target to full duration. This does
 not change the damage of the rip on the target (also called snapshotting). This is
 referred to as Blood in the Water (BitW) or execute range.
 Rip  Rip has less than 2 seconds remaining.  Rip uptime is one of the pivotal goals for a Feral. When you "clip"
 the end of a Rip that has less than 2 seconds left, the remaining duration is added to
 the new Rip. This important to take advantage of for maximum uptime.
 Savage Roar  Savage Roar has less than 3 seconds
 remaining or Savage Roar has a small
 amount of time remaining and
 might clash with your reapplication
 of Rip.
 Just like Rip this can be refreshed with less than 3 seconds left
 without wasting any duration, and this should be taken advantage of to achieve high
 uptimes. This is perhaps the most important part of the entire rotation; you should never
 do anything while Savage Roar is down except refresh Savage Roar.
 Rake  Rake has less than 3 seconds remaining.  This can be refreshed with less than 3 seconds left
 without wasting any duration, and this should be taken advantage of to achieve high
 uptimes. Rake does a ton of damage for how easy it easy to keep up.
 Thrash  Thrash has less than 3 seconds
 remaining and one of the following:
  • You're at 5 CP.
  • Berserk is up.
  • Rip & SR have plenty of time left.
 This can be refreshed with less than 3 seconds left
 without wasting any duration, and this should be taken advantage of to achieve high
 uptimes. This doesn't consume or generate combo points but it does
 a significant amount of damage for the cost.
 Ferocious Bite  You're at 5 CP, Rip is up, and you're 1
 second away from full energy.
 This is your CP dump, use it sparingly. You want to wait til near-full
 energy so that A) it gets full damage, and B) You allow yourself to spend the CP on other
 finishers if it becomes appropriate while you're waiting to FB.
 Use a CP generator  Any of the following:
  • Omen of Clarity is up.
  • Rip or SR are about to expire.
  • Berserk is up.
  • TF is about to come off cooldown.
  • You're about to energy cap.
 This is where you generate CP so you can actually do something.
 Which generator you use (Ravage, Rake, Mangle or Shred) depends on a couple different
 things. See the next section on CP generators!


 Which CP Generator to Use and When

Not only is Rake one of our most potent bleeds, but it is also quite effective at dealing direct damage. It should be used any time it deals more damage than a Mangle (without clipping a stronger rake) which most typically happens during a Rune of Re-Origination proc, but can also happen during periods of high attack power in high item level gear.

Ravage should be used when possible (as a part of your opener when feasible) but is typically not used during the normal course of combat as Incarnation is an extremely poor talent for PvE.

Mangle and Shred are somewhat interchangeable; while Shred does deal 20% more damage it's more expensive and is therefore slightly less effective at generating combo points, the net result being that additional combo points equal out the direct damage loss when converted into additional Ferocious Bites. So which one should you use? Generally it's advisable to use Mangle as your primary CP generator and substitute in Shred during periods of high energy (such as Berserk, Omen of Clarity, and Heroism/Bloodlust), this will allow you to take advantage of the increased combo point generation to make Savage Roar and Rip a little easier to maintain, while minimalizing periods of energy capping.

If you're the type that wants to know how much of a difference we're talking, here's a comparison from Catus using 580 gear. I've included results using both SotF/DoC and FoN/HotW for the sake of inclusiveness.
Spoiler: show
   Mean  Median
 SotF/DoC
 Shred only  462250  460328
 Mangle only  460736  459056
 Shrangle  463360  461662
 FoN/HotW
 Shred only  448370  446650
 Mangle only  447478  446185
 Shrangle  448828  447249


 Bleed Clipping

Bleed clipping is the act of overwriting your current bleeds with new ones to take advantage in the difference of damage between the two bleeds, and it is what seperates decent ferals from great ones (this is an excellent place to look if you're looking to improve your damage). For example, you may have a Rip on the target that you applied with no procs active, and when one of your trinkets procs you overwrite it with a new Rip to take advantage of the trinket proc. This is a very prominent feature in advanced feral play, moreso than almost any other specialization in the game, and is possible because of our extremely weak hitting Ferocious Bite.

The most simple form of bleed clipping involves just keeping track mentally of what effects you had when you applied your last Rip, and while this is certainly viable, it is not something I would recommend unless you prefer to do things the hard way just for the sake of it. To take full advantage of bleed clipping, the feral should have an UI element that can tell them the strength of their current bleed relative to one you could apply right now. Ovale Spell Priority with Leafkiller's script takes account of bleed clipping automatically when providing suggestions, but if that's not your thing then this WeakAura is an excellent alternative.

Generally speaking, it's advisable to clip both Rip and Rake any time you can put up one that's at least 15% stronger. It can also be advantageous to apply a slightly weaker bleed than the current (but still a quite strong one in general) prior to your procs ending to take maximum advantage of them. For example, if you apply a Tiger's Fury'd Rake a few seconds into your 15 second trinket proc, it would be advisable to clip that Rake (with a slightly weaker one since by then TF would be over) near the end of the trinket proc for maximum effect (the same can also be applied to Rip and other more complex situations).

 Blood in the Water / Execute Range

Thanks to a fairly unique attribute of Ferocious Bite which allows us to refresh the duration of our Rip without changing the strength of the DoT while the enemy is below 25% health, bleed clipping plays a very prominent role in giving us one of the best "executes" in the game. To maximize the effect of this, the feral should be aiming to get the strongest Rip possible applied when or after the enemy is nearing 25% health, and then making sure that it is continually refreshed with Ferocious Bite until the end of the encounter. Generally this means aligning your cooldowns and second potion with trinket procs to the greatest extent possible.
Last edited by aggixx on Sun Sep 08, 2013 11:22 pm, edited 39 times in total.

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 5:14 am

 Talents

(PLACEHOLDER)

 Tier 1
Situational. In most cases it will depend on your personal preference but there's also several encounters where 1 or 2 of the choices are distinctly superior.

 Tier 2
In general this tier is fairly underwhelming and not particularly consequential given how many other great personal defensive abilities we have as feral. Preference mostly. I prefer to use Ysera's Gift as I really don't feel like I need an additional cooldown to press.

 Tier 3
Situational, but Typhoon is generally the most useful/versatile so that's a good thing to use by default. Faerie Swarm and Mass Entanglement can be useful on an encounter by encounter basis.

 Tier 4
As much as you probably want to use Incarnation, don't, it sucks. Force of Nature is quite strong an excellent choice for beginners, but Force of Nature can be superior on single target when executed correctly (sit between 2 and 3 charges, dump during trinket procs).

 Tier 5
Situational. Unlike tier 3 these are all frequently useful in their own situation.

 Tier 6
Probably the most debated tier if there is one.
Heart of the Wild: Great utility! During the effect we're actually okay at tanking when paired with some of your feral cooldowns, Tranquility heals more than almost any raid cooldown, and Hurricane spam can do ridiculous amounts of damage (use a SP weapon if you can). Damage is middle of the road but the effect is passive so it's great for beginners as well.
Dream of Cenarius: Highest DPS option, basically no utility whatsoever, more complex than the other options but it's not particularly difficult with some practice. To use appropriately, spend your Predatory Swiftness procs when you reach 4 or more CP or when they are about to expire. One stack should be used on a finisher, and the other should be used on Rake (if appropriate, see Bleed Clipping in the Rotation section), or a filler.
Nature's Vigil: Great utility but often quite situational. Damage is less than the other two options so you generally only want to take this when you're optimizing around burst damage with little regard to your total DPS. It should be used with Berserk as well as once in between each Berserk.
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 5:33 am

 Glyphs
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:34 am

 Gearing

 Stat Priority and Reforging

Normal:
Agility > Weapon DPS > Exp to 2550 >= Hit to 2550 > Mastery > Crit > Haste > Strength > AP

Rune of Re-Origination:
Agility > Weapon DPS > Exp to 2550 >= Hit to 2550 > Mastery = Crit = Haste > Strength > AP

Exact relative values of secondary stats will vary depending on your gear, trinkets, secondary bonuses, etc. If you're interested in stat weights, you can retrieve them for your character using SimulationCraft or Catus (See How can I simulate my character? in the FAQ), although note that secondary stat values from SimulationCraft when using Rune of Re-Origination are relatively useless.

Reforging without Rune of Re-Origination is relatively straightforward: achieve your hit and expertise caps while sacrificing as little mastery as possible. It's highly recommended to use a reforge optimizer like Catus or AskMrRobot.

For ferals using Rune of Re-Origination, things are a bit more complicated. The trinket's proc is only valuable when it's proccing mastery, which means you must maintain mastery as your highest stat, however it is also beneficial to maximize your haste and crit to increase the size of the proc as high as possible. This means you'll be trying to achieve a "1:1:1" reforge configuration, for example, you might aim to have 2550 hit, 2550 expertise, 8000 haste, 8000 crit, and 8001 mastery. The two tools linked above can both also handle this reforging method, and you definitely don't want to be doing this by hand.

 Enchants

Slot  Enchant  Profession
Shoulders  [Greater Tiger Claw Inscription]  [Secret Tiger Claw Inscription]
Cloak  [Enchant Cloak - Superior Critical Strike]
 [Enchant Cloak - Accuracy]
 Swordguard Embroidery
Chest  [Enchant Chest - Glorious Stats]
Bracers  [Enchant Bracer - Greater Agility]  Fur Lining - Agility
Gloves  [Enchant Gloves - Superior Mastery]
 [Enchant Gloves - Superior Expertise]
 [Enchant Gloves - Greater Haste] (RoRO users only!)
 Synapse Springs
Belt  [Living Steel Belt Buckle]  
Legs  [Shadowleather Leg Armor]  Primal Leg Reinforcements
Boots  [Enchant Boots - Blurred Speed]  
Weapon  [Enchant Weapon - Dancing Steel]  


 Gemming

There are two gemming methods that a feral may use, the first is applicable to most and should be used if you are not using Rune of Re-Origination, and the second should be used if you are using it and if it and your gear are of sufficient item level. If you use Rune and are trying to determine which gemming method to use, you must load your character into Catus and simulate the two options, as it depends on your specific combination of gear.

Note: All gems can be substituted for their "Perfect" equivalent (eg. [Perfect Delicate Pandaren Garnet] for a red socket).

Primary
Slot  Gem
Meta  [Capacitive Primal Diamond] (requires legendary quest progression)
 [Agile Primal Diamond]
Red  [Delicate Primordial Ruby]
Yellow  [Adept Vermilion Onyx]
 [Deft Vermilion Onyx] (Rune of Re-Origination only)
 [Deadly Vermilion Onyx] (Rune of Re-Origination only)
Blue  [Glinting Imperial Amethyst]

Secondary (see above)
Slot  Gem
Meta  [Capacitive Primal Diamond] (requires legendary quest progression)
 [Agile Primal Diamond]
Red  [Keen Vermilion Onyx]
 [Wicked Vermilion Onyx]
 [Crafty Vermilion Onyx]
Yellow  [Fractured Sun's Radiance]
 [Smooth Sun's Radiance]
 [Quick Sun's Radiance]
Blue  [Sensei's Wild Jade]
 [Piercing Wild Jade]
 [Lightning Wild Jade]


 Best in Slot

The following is the Best in Slot list for T16. This list is intended for normal and heroic only, but in theory should also apply to Flex mode and LFR pretty well too.

Slot Non-Warforged BiS Warforged BiS
Head [Headpiece of the Shattered Vale] (Thok the Bloodthirsty)
Neck [Immerseus' Crystalline Eye] (Immerseus)
Shoulders [Shoulderguards of the Righteous Stand] (General Nazgrim)  [Spaulders of the Shattered Vale] (Siegecrafter Blackfuse)
Back [Fen-Yu, Fury of Xuen] (Legendary Questline)
Chest [Raiment of the Shattered Vale] (Sha of Pride)
Wrists [Bomber's Blackened Wristwatch] (Siegecrafter Blackfuse)
Hands [Grips of the Shattered Vale] (General Nazgrim)
Waist [Cord of Black Dreams] (Garrosh Hellscream)
Legs [Legguards of the Shattered Vale] (Paragons of the Klaxxi) [Riou's Vigilant Leggings] (Kor'kron Dark Shaman)
Feet [Pandaren Roofsprinters] (Spoils of Pandaria)
Ring [Swift Serpent Signet] (Galakras)
Ring [Kil'ruk's Band of Ascendancy] (Paragons of the Klaxxi)
Trinket 1 [Rune of Re-Origination] (Lei Shen)
Trinket 2 [Assurance of Consequence] (Sha of Pride) or
[Haromm's Talisman] (Kor'kron Dark Shaman) or
[Ticking Ebon Detonator] (Siegecrafter Blackfuse)
Main Hand  [Hellscream's Pig Sticker] (Garrosh Hellscream) [Halberd of Inner Shadows] (Malkorok)

* Second trinket slot selection depends on the encounter. Ticking Ebon Detonator is theoretically best for Patchwerk encounters, but loses some value in practice to reaction times to the proc and hinges heavily on the presence of an execute phase. Assurance of Consequence is generally the lowest DPS option, but having a different burst interval and shorter CDs on your personals can be preferrable on some encounters (preference).
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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:35 am

 Trinkets

While I've made every effort to make these results as indicative of each trinket's relative value as possible, the nature of the simulations means that these rankings are not perfectly accurate. As always, it never hurts to sim your character for yourself if you want to know what trinket is best.

 High Item Level Trinkets

These sims are done with a fully upgraded T16N profile with 4pT16, no legendary items except for the meta gem, and a 549 Rune of Re-Origination.

It is important to note that a high enough item level Rune of Re-Origination is the best trinket but it cannot be appropriately ranked against the other trinkets because of it's strange stat interaction and gearing incentives. See the Rune of Re-Origination section of the FAQ for more information.

Image
Image


 Low Item Level Trinkets

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Re: Pawkets' Feral DPS Guide / FAQ

Postby aggixx » Tue Nov 27, 2012 6:47 am

 Frequently Asked Questions

 What's changed in patch 5.4?

Nature's Swiftness has been replaced with Ysera's Gift. This is a slight nerf to Dream of Cenarius' flexibility and damage, and to compensate Dream of Cenarius was buffed from 25% to 30%. Because of this, Dream of Cenarius is a bit less flexible but its damage in comparison to Heart of the Wild is about the same as it was in 5.3. This does not however mean HotW is useless for maximizing DPS, see the talents section for more info.

Nature's Vigil has been buffed from 10% to 12%, making it usable but not quite good enough to be worth using over the other two options. It may be worth using in situations where the talent's utility seems very appealing to the encounter, but otherwise you should still avoid using it.

Force of Nature was changed from stunning the target on summon to both rooting and applying rake on summon. The rake does 1/3rd of the damage of the druid, stacks with the druid's and other treants', and scales with the druid's mastery. While the new & improved version is viable, and even optimal on multiple encounters, in most cases it is not advised (specifically for less experienced players, see the talents section for more info).

Wrath now deals 10% more damage, but has its mana cost increased by 50%. This is modest buff to Heart of the Wild single target damage, making the active a tiny DPS gain if you have a caster weapon that is equal item level to your agi weapon. You're probably better off using the active for healing or AoEing instead in most cases, though.

Cyclone no longer has a 20-second cooldown. Predatory Swiftness can longer be used to cast an in-form instant Cyclone.

Bear Form now increases Stamina by 40% (up from 20%). This makes Might of Ursoc a bit stronger of a defensive cooldown than before, giving a bit higher of an effective health pool.

 When do I replace my Rune of Re-Origination?

Rule of Thumb: If you have a heroic (543) or heroic thunderforged (549) Rune of Re-Origination, it is best in slot as long as your gear is approximately the same level as the trinkets Rune is competing with. So for example, if your item level is 561 and you have a choice between 543 Rune or 561 Haromm's Talisman, Rune will be better. However since Rune scales with the stats on your gear, if your item level is 553, it may be possible that the 561 Haromm's Talisman could be better; in this case you would have to sim it yourself to know for sure.

If you have a 536 or less Rune of Re-Origination, you'll likely want to replace Rune once you have 2 Siege of Orgrimmar trinkets. Again, if you want to be sure when you should or shouldn't replace Rune, you'll have to sim it for yourself, I can't possibly sim every combination of trinkets and gear.

If you're interested in specifics, check out these simulation results:
549 in BiS, 543 in BiS, 536 in BiS, 530/536/543 in normal mode

 Which trinket should I use? Should I break my set bonus? etc.

In most cases the answer to your question will be specific to your own character and you'll have to determine the answer yourself using Catus or SimulationCraft (check the next section in this FAQ for information on how to do this).

If you're having troubles getting one of these programs to work, feel free to post your question in this thread and someone may help you out. If you do ask for help, make sure you include a link to your armory (or character name and realm)! If you don't do this, 90% of the time we won't be able to tell you the answer for sure.

 How can I simulate my character?

Raffy has an excellent guide to doing simple DPS comparisons in Catus which I highly recommend for any of your simulation/theorycrafting desires. There's also a handful of guides for using SimulationCraft that you can find via google, such as this one, this one, or this one.
Last edited by aggixx on Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:09 pm, edited 14 times in total.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Xube » Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:44 pm

This is a pretty detailed post.

Thanks for the research!

I have a question though. i see that you have listed the stat weights for each last teir skill. Currently i use a dual spec of DoC and the other for HotW.


I have been looking for a way to get Askmrrobot to work in my favor. Because it is wrong it does make me gem all weird. So Can i actually use these stat weights for that?
and if not (which i will try to do tonight after work)

So if not, what can i use these stat weights for?

Thanks!

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Instaqueues » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:22 pm

Xube,
You can plug those weights into Mr. Robot. The only thing I hate about that is to get hit/exp capped gauranteed, you have to weight those so high it looks ridiculous. I usually put a 15.0 weight on hit/exp, otherwise it likes to keep me just below cap.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Tinderhoof » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:28 pm

Wowreforge.com is way better for doing what you are looking for. They have options (on by default) for you to reach stat caps for any type you want. If you want to reforge your haste for a specific level, just put it in the box, and you are set. If you are in Feral Spec, you just go with the defaults.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Instaqueues » Mon Dec 03, 2012 5:56 pm

Let me give that a shot, because I'm trying to figure out if the darkmoon trinket will be worth getting over some others that are realistically available to me soon.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby aggixx » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:04 pm

AskMrRobot is a great gear optimization tool but the reforge engine behind it is admittedly weak (edit: This is no longer the case, feel free to use it to your heart's content). While its suggestions for gemming and enchanting will be spot on (given you're using the correct weights) I much prefer to use WoWReforge or ReforgeLite for reforges.

But yes, if you just throw those stat weights into any of those 3 tools you should get pretty accurate results. Keep in mind that weights for your character might be a bit different than weights in best in slot gear, but at the moment it doesn't change things up significantly so you should be able to use these no problem.
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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Tinderhoof » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:13 pm

Short answer is "Yes". Until you start getting heroic raiding trinkets the Darkmoon card will be #1 or #2.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Instaqueues » Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:21 pm

Thanks for this guide, and responses! Your answers match SimCraft, with various trinket combinations. For my gear it looks like Searing Words & Relic put me at about 82.9k, and Relic & Jade Bandit Figurine give me 82.8k. Looks like. Now to get the $$ for a relic! ;)

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby coool12 » Wed Dec 05, 2012 2:24 am

nice posts...........

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Kioga » Thu Dec 06, 2012 7:45 pm

Any idea where the new (496) Arrowflight Medallion trink ranks on the list?

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Dec 06, 2012 8:05 pm

Its on the list as Wound Ripper (the Horde version).

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Arctagon » Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:50 pm

Thank you for the comprehensive list, aggixx.

I have a couple of questions. How do you compare talents and trinkets in SimC, getting those bar charts up? Also, is there any good or usable character planners out there, like chardev used to be?

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Irbis » Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:04 pm

Thank you for your work.

I am a bit confused about the stat weights and was hoping you could help me out there.
What was the Tier 4 talent used to gain the stat values?
Or are the simulations made with only Tier 6 talents?, and if they are made with only the Tier 6 talents, wouldn't the tier 4 talent choice influence the stat values?

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby aggixx » Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:46 am

Arctagon wrote:Thank you for the comprehensive list, aggixx.

I have a couple of questions. How do you compare talents and trinkets in SimC, getting those bar charts up? Also, is there any good or usable character planners out there, like chardev used to be?

It's just a screenshot + crop of the graph on the HTML report spit out by SimC. For character planning I believe CharDev still works although I could be wrong, but you can also do the same thing with AskMrRobot.
Irbis wrote:Thank you for your work.

I am a bit confused about the stat weights and was hoping you could help me out there.
What was the Tier 4 talent used to gain the stat values?
Or are the simulations made with only Tier 6 talents?, and if they are made with only the Tier 6 talents, wouldn't the tier 4 talent choice influence the stat values?

Sorry, I had it in the description at some point. They are all done with Soul of the Forest as the other two alternatives tend to be very very situational. And yes, it probably does.
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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Stenhaldi » Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:28 am

Are you using the PTR version of Woundripper Medallion (with 2822 crit)? I'm not seeing how the live version (with 3838 crit) could compare so poorly.

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby aggixx » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:14 pm

That'd be the case, working on updating the rankings atm.
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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby aggixx » Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:09 pm

Trinket comparisons updated, now also includes upgraded versions of 5 man heroic trinkets.
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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Eralia » Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:53 pm

Is there any reliable Sims, that confirm the EJ post about haste being the best secondary stat depending on the Talentcombination?

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Re: Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:06 pm

Could you link us to that post? Do you know if it was prior to the HotW nerf after week 2 of the new tier?

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