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Low feral dps output

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Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:15 am

Hey all,

been a while since I visited, but I kinda need help again.
I'm having major trouble keeping up with my DPS and Damage done numbers in regards to our raid team. When looking at WoL, my numbers are ridiculously low compared to everyone else in the team.
Yet when I look at the numbers flying over my screen, I see high numbers, so I really don't understand what I'm doing wrong....
I try to keep SR, RIP and Rake up as much as possible and I pop my talents whenever they are off cooldown for some increased damage bursts. Even created a macro that pops all my talents in sequence such as Berserk, Nature's vigil etc for less downtime.

WoL Report from Mogu'Shan Vaults
Armory

I know I'm currently not capped on hit and expertise, will do that this evening because I just got some new pieces. Any advice is welcome to help me improve my character.
Just don't tell me to upgrade my gear as I'm working on the VP for that, and yes I know I miss my weapon enchant, but I wanne get a better weapon first.
I used to play with Ovale script, but trying to play without it at the moment.

Really love my kitty, and I want to make it more viable in the raid. Right now I'm raiding because I'm the RL, but I dont want to be a burden on the team or get carried through stuff with these numbers.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Sabrac » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:52 am

Didn't have a thorough look but here's what i could find so far

(I used the Imperial Vizier kill as an example)

SR Uptime: 82 % - this is really low, try aiming for 95 to 98 %
Rake Uptime: 94.5 % - Rake uptime should never be higher than your SR uptime, although this is generally a nice enough uptime (if your SR uptime was also 95 % +)
Rip uptime: 69 % - this is quite a low uptime aswell
Trash uptime: 12 % - this could be due to OOC procs but overal this is quite a low uptime aswell.

Talents: Incarnation - It's a good talent for a short period of burst, but overall on bossfights, Soul of the forest beats this by quite a bit (more energy to use on abilities, generally leads to higher uptimes aswell ^^).

Rip / Rake damage: 22k average tick and 45k average crit is quite low considering your Mastery
Compared to what my druid does in that fight (see: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-kbt8n ... 218&e=1749)
Where i manage to hit 29k average tick and 60k average crit, this could make all the difference in dps :).

Even though during that fight i also only got a 87 % SR uptime (still working on getting that higher ^^), so yea, I know I'm not one to point out the flaws of others while I still make the same mistakes :) But i hope it helps.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:11 am

I'll try switching the talents and see what the difference brings. I'll also use Ovalescript again to help me track the uptimes properly of the dots and SR so I don't miss them anymore.
What would be a possible solution on increasing the damage from my ticks? My mastery is pretty high, so any explanation as to why it would be so low?

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Sabrac » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:21 am

Nashiko wrote:I'll try switching the talents and see what the difference brings. I'll also use Ovalescript again to help me track the uptimes properly of the dots and SR so I don't miss them anymore.
What would be a possible solution on increasing the damage from my ticks? My mastery is pretty high, so any explanation as to why it would be so low?


Well, i see you didnt have the Grace of Air / Blessing of might / Roar of courage buff (aka 3000 mastery), which could explain the DoT damage
Although with 2 shamans, Grace of Air shouldnt be a problem to have.

That's currently the only explanation i could find.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:27 am

Sabrac wrote:
Nashiko wrote:I'll try switching the talents and see what the difference brings. I'll also use Ovalescript again to help me track the uptimes properly of the dots and SR so I don't miss them anymore.
What would be a possible solution on increasing the damage from my ticks? My mastery is pretty high, so any explanation as to why it would be so low?


Well, i see you didnt have the Grace of Air / Blessing of might / Roar of courage buff (aka 3000 mastery), which could explain the DoT damage
Although with 2 shamans, Grace of Air shouldnt be a problem to have.

That's currently the only explanation i could find.


Alright, I will slap my Shamans around next time :)

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Instaqueues » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:09 am

my DPS drops signifigantly w/o mastery buff. We ran 1 week w/o it, and I think the raid overall suffered an average 10-15k dps drop for almost every person.

I use badkitty to track my bleeds/buffs, and it helps to give a visual (with bars/timers) to see when things will expire, so you can plan ahead. I also use Droodfocus for PS procs (although BK tracks this, I like Droodfocus better for it :D), it also gives you warnings when you're not behind the target, which is very nice.

I think it's been pretty much covered though, I would suggest SotF and HotW talents, both great passive talents, and while HotW isn't the best currently, it's not far behind DoC, and you don't have to learn anything with it.

SR uptime should be 100% (which translates to 95%+ in battle situations cuz we all aren't perfect!)

My rip is usually ~85% - 90%, and rake is about whatever SR is (95%+). Gear shouldn't be an issue if you're having these questions :D The first week I switched to cat I was doing ~50k, then came here and next week was doing ~70k with no gear changes, so we are all learning how to be better together!

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Tinderhoof » Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:56 pm

Hi again Nashiko. I have gone over your armory and your logs and I have a few suggestions.
Gear:
Based on your gear, you should not be attempting to get any socket bonuses that are not all red. Both your chest and your legs socket bonuses are not worth the Agility loss. I would replace all 3 of your Agi/Mastery gems with straight Agi. I would also suggest biting the bullet and getting a Darkmoon card. It is by far the easiest gear upgrade you can get right now. With the Fair being so far away cards themselves should be cheaper. I would start collecting for a deck if you are not able to afford one now. Use your farm to grow spare herbs and have one of your guild scribes mill them and save up mats for cards. Also while you are waiting for a better weapon, at least put Windsong on your current weapon. You are throwing damage away by not having at least something.

Logs:
Based on your logs I have a feeling that you are missing some concepts about Feral dps and how it has changed since Cata. In Cata Savage Roar boosted your white damage by 80%. It was a nice boost, but it could be allowed to fall off for short times in favor of Rip. In MoP Savage Roar has reverted to its Wrath of the Lich King incarnation of boosting all of your damage by 30%. The critical difference here is that our bleeds are snapshots of whatever buffs you have at the time. This includes Agi/Mastery procs, Tiger' Fury, and Savage Roar. If you do not have Savage Roar up when you apply a bleed it will do 30% less damage then it should for its entire duration even if you apply Savage Roar later. In your Vizier log it looks like you didn't get Savage Roar up until you had both Rake and Rip ticking for several seconds and you had hit Berserk. This happened a few more times in the fight which you applied Rip or Rake while Savage Roar was down. You must never do this. Even if both are down spend the energy and whatever combo points you have to get SR going before doing anything. You also have the SR glyph to allow you to use SR without combo points. Make sure you use this pre pull so SR is running prior to any attacks.

As Sabrac brought up Incarnation is our worst DPS talent. It Ravage is just too expensive to be realistic in all but a few situations. The biggest issue though is that you selected this talent, but only used it 1 time in a 7:30 fight. In order for this talent to help your damage at all you have to use it as often as possible (and it must be used with Berserk). You did use Berserk 2 times in the fight, but didn't use TF at the same time. The same is also true for Natures Vigil. If you do not use the talent to its full potential you are just hurting yourself. I would recommend that you use SotF, and HotW while you get used to the rotation provided by Ovale. These new talents do not provide any additional cooldowns to use over your TF and Berserk. Also you need to make sure when you Berserk you also use Tigers Fury for the damage bonus and the energy boost (you did not do so during the fight). Same goes for your Flashing Steel trinket. You did not use it once. I would recommend making a macro that uses the trinket to your TF. If you are using TF and Berserk on cooldown you will have the big Agi proc from it for every berserk and every 3rd TF.

If you have any questions on the feedback feel free to let me know. Good luck in raiding this week.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:54 am

Thanks for the feedback Tinder :)

Yesterday I already swapped some of my gear to get the hit cap again. Expertise cap is not possible atm with my current gear, so missing a few points there at the moment.

* Will definitly pop windsong again on my weapon.
* Will replace gems today before the raid
* Already replaced Incarnation with SoF, and on the dummy the difference was already noticable in a 2 minute fight.
* Will take a look at that deck.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Instaqueues » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:21 pm

From what I've read, if u can get the terrace LFR trinket, you will pair that with the darkmoon card until you can replace darkmoon card w/ heroic Elegon trinket. In other words, the priority would look like this:

Heroic Terrace
Normal Terrace
Heroic Elegon
Darkmoon card
LFR Terrace
Normal Elegon
LFR Elegon

It's been a worthwhile investment for me so far.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:32 pm

ok, just to be sure, what card exactly am I looking for?

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Vaporgriffin » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:36 pm

Instaqueues wrote:From what I've read, if u can get the terrace LFR trinket, you will pair that with the darkmoon card until you can replace darkmoon card w/ heroic Elegon trinket. In other words, the priority would look like this:

Heroic Terrace
Normal Terrace
Heroic Elegon
Darkmoon card
LFR Terrace
Normal Elegon
LFR Elegon

It's been a worthwhile investment for me so far.


I'm not quite sure about your rankings - Aggixx's post puts the LFR Terrace trinket pretty low on the list, and that's what I've read elsewhere.

Just for reference, here are the trinket analysis rankings from Aggixx's post:

Heroic Elegon
Heroic Terrace
Normal Elegon
Darkmoon
Normal Terrace
LFR Elegon
Alchemist Stone (blue)
Searing Words (blue)
LFR Terrace

Basically, the Terrace trinket is much lower in ranking (the LFR version is lower than a couple of blue trinket options) than your list suggests, and the Elegon trinket is much higher. The DMC is very good right up until you start replacing trinkets with heroic versions, though, so it's always a good investment.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Instaqueues » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:51 pm

Hrmm, I'm not sure where I got my info, it was during the last fair. Might have been somewhere over at Mr. Robot, maybe even his bis list w/ updated stat weights, I'm not sure.

I passed up the normal elegon trinket to a hunter a couple weeks ago, makes me sad...but at least it keeps my competition in DPS w/ him even to make it fun :)

But to answer your question, you are looking for
Relic of Xuen
I think it's the tiger deck, but a quick google could answer that part.

Make sure it is the Agi one, because this name is used for both Agi and Str. version. So just pay attention :D

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:42 pm

bough it ^^
Also changed my gems as pointed out and got the enchant. Already noticing higher damage output now on trash mobs :)


Thanks guys ^^

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Instaqueues » Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:32 pm

Well good luck! Make sure to train on the dummy daily! Back in my younger years I could just jump right in and no problems, now I have to rely on muscle memory a lot more :P

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:03 pm

hehe, and what makes you think I'm a young kitten :P ?

Noticed DPS to be a lot higher now. Reached Elegon after 1 hour of raiding, and average DPS is now in the 52k range, with spikes going higher.

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Re: Low feral dps output

Postby Nashiko » Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:02 pm

WoL logs: Clicky Clicky
Still not perfect, but at least a major improvement. DPS increased a lot compared to previous run, almost doubled, so I'm happy.

Also got like 6 new item upgrades, so expect to get even better DPS now the next time around.
Just need to invest a bit in gems and enchants to top it off.
Not sure if I can get hit and expertise capped yet with this gear.

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