Talent & Trinket Analysis (w/ Stat Weights!)

[Eralia Profile]

http://elitistjerks.com/f73/t130906-feral_cat_mists_pandaria_5_0_4_a/#Stat_Values That post

And yes it was before the nerf, but I was told/had read somewhere that they had updated the Thread accordingly.

[Tinderhoof Profile]

Gotcha. The only 3 instances they recomend Haste as anything but dead last is with HotW. While they have made some adjustments to the thread there is plenty of out of date information (Haste for HotW included). It isn't worth gimping your damage for 5:15 of every 6 minutes because Wrath spam isn't much better then a normal rotation.

[Arctagon Profile]

It's just a screenshot + crop of the graph on the HTML report spit out by SimC. For character planning I believe CharDev still works although I could be wrong, but you can also do the same thing with AskMrRobot.

I have never seen any such graphs on my SimC reports while simming my character, so I take it you must do something specific to get them into the report?

CharDev is unfortunately useless right now, as its database is missing half of the MoP items currently in-game. I will take a look at AskMrRobot, thank you.

[Instaqueues Profile]

I don't have the best gear, I'd say it's average, with a 387 ilvl, but I've been messing around with stat weights a bit, and trying to find something in game that's useful with the UV bug. I've basically taken the stats here and switched them around.

1.93 Mastery
1.75 Haste
1.66 Crit
1.65 Hit/Exp (7.50% cap forced)

On a normal SimC report, my dps goes down ~100, from 87.7 to 87.6. However, the extra haste allows me to keep rip up for a longer time, which on a real boss fight gives me more DPS.

Just some info I've been digging into, use it if you want, ignore if if you want...but it's here!

[aggixx Profile]

I have never seen any such graphs on my SimC reports while simming my character, so I take it you must do something specific to get them into the report?

No, I don't do anything special. As long as I can remember graphs have been in the report by default. I do know that the graphs use a google chart API to generate them so if you don't have an internet connection when you look at the report then it probably won't load the chart.

@Instaqueues: Yeah, haste almost definitely beats crit with the UV bug.

[Kihrawr Profile]

Any chance of updating the list to show the Zen Alchemist Stone with a JP upgrade?

[aggixx Profile]

It would've been in the initial update but the way that the trinket's proc is coded in SimC right now (because of the dynamic proc) it's currently not scaling correctly =(

[Etapicx Profile]

Requesting 2/2 upgrade verision of Xuen of possible <3

[aggixx Profile]

Added, since it's a likely upgrade candidate for people who are nearing VP cap and don't have any BiS pieces to use it on.

[Sorcerer Profile]

@ Aggixx, question.
Is it possible to somehow sim ONLY the execute phase with some script conditional to 'always sim perfectly buffed rip' manually?

Be only my guess that relic + elegon trinket should be much higher ahead for good players having the ability to get powerful RIP for BITW. Comparing to elegon + lei-shi, but it is really unlikcly to sim 2 trinkets at a time. I hope they fix Ursol couse it really makes Relic 2/2 stronger than Terror HC 2/2...

85k AP in BIS gear with procs lined...

[aggixx Profile]

Yes, it is possible using target_initial_health_percentage=25 or target_fixed_health_percentage=20. That way you would always carry your opener rip all the way through the fight, although if you're doing that you might want to tweak some conditionals a tad to make sure it's got all of it's procs up before it rips, if possible.

[archury Profile]

I see in the trinket comparison the upgraded relic is compared to the heroic 509 terror without upgrades. Any chance we could see a comparison with the 517 terror?

Thanks in advance.

[aggixx Profile]

If trinket A beats trinket B when both are 0/2 upgraded, trinket A will still beat trinket B when they're both upgraded (and by a similar margin). Because of this the best non-upgraded trinkets are also the best upgraded trinkets and that's why I don't have upgraded versions of every single trinket in the rankings.

[archury Profile]

My mistake; thank you.

[aggixx Profile]

Updated everything for the newest SimC action list, also added Deadeye Badge trinket (Dominator's Deadeye Badge / Deadeye Badge of the Shield Wall).

[Dysheki Profile]

Well, they nerfed the haste used a bit for other classes in the RPPM system. Still doesn't address the dubious reasoning for a secondary stat (that may or may not be good for certain classes) to determine how powerful a trinket can be, but it at least decreases the gap.

Just a reminder that RealPPM now uses your true melee haste or spell haste (whichever is higher) to scale the proc rate instead of attack speed or casting speed. The difference is that things that buff your attack speed (such as the raid buff or Slice and Dice) do not increase the frequency of RPPM procs. True haste boosts, such as Bloodlust or haste rating on gear will improve proc rate. We felt this change was necessary to balance proc rates among different specs.

[Etapicx Profile]

The latest change will it make so we won't have to wait like 5 mins to proc Rune of Re-Origination? If so... YEAH!!

[aggixx Profile]

It's ~4.5% nerf to the proc rate of RPPM for Feral. We lose the benefit of the 10% Attack Speed raid buff on our trinkets, and Spell Haste then becomes our highest haste due to the Spell Haste raid buff.

And since someone will inevitably ask, I hope to have some trinket comparisons up before launch today, but I'm not certain I'll have the time. At worst it will be up this weekend sometime.

[aggixx Profile]

Updated talent comparisons, stat weights for both Rune and non-Rune profiles coming soon.

[Vaults Profile]

I’m wondering what are going to be BiS trinket for tier 15. Is it worth it to go for the VP trinket from the new faction if you have BiS trinkets from tier 14 2/2 upgraded?

[aggixx Profile]

Rough list that assumes you can use all of the stats on the item:
H Rune of Re-Origination
H Renataki's Soul Charm
Vicious Talisman of the Shado-Pan Assault
H Bad Juju
H Talisman of Bloodlust

Not certain on how normal mode versions of said trinkets stack up against their heroic counterparts. If you can use the hit from Vicious Talisman pretty effectively then it is probably the best VP purchase you can make.

Stat weights have been updated.

[Alpheus Profile]

Small question: in your T15 BiS itemization thread you've posted sims for different T15 trinkets in an example of BiS T15 gear. While I noted that Retanaki was set to exp=0 (what I assume is because of expertise overflow on gear), but why is the rune of reorigination set to 0 agility as well?

Code: Select all

rune_of_reorigination,id=96546,stats=0agi

Was the character snapshot somehow overflowed on agility or is this an error?

[aggixx Profile]

I recall there being a legitimate reason for it at the time but the exact reason escapes me. Something to do with preventing scaling from crashing the sim or something like that. Regardless I've done plenty of comparisons where there's no fishy shortcuts taken in evaluating the trinkets and each set of trinkets has it's own profile with it's own reforges.

[aggixx Profile]

A short note, all of these calculations were done before we knew the Rip buff had not gone live, I'll probably have to rerun them again today or this weekend.

[feralminded Profile]

Very curious as to why the Bad Juju 528 is below the 522. Seems fishy to me (also selfishly interested since I just got the 528 and replaced my 484 Xuen and desperately hoping it wasn't a waste of GP)