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Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Syo » Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:04 pm

Tinderhoof wrote:Some one still have Terror equipped?


I don't know why I'm FINALLY setting up an account to post on these forums, since I read them and the WoW forums often, but I still have my Heroic Terror in the Mists in my bags (for tanking and because RoR kinda sucks for challenge modes), why were you curious?

Got my RoR Sunday but unfortunately didn't get to give it a try as I was benched for last night's raid, but hopefully I'll get to give it a try tonight, was testing it on a target dummy and some of the bleeds I could put up were juicy.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:24 pm

Terror + Rune = Bad times. I made that comment because the pervious poster was trying to figure out why Rune kept proc'ing Crit. Also I don't know why you think Rune is bad for challenge modes? Is it because you are tanking? Cause it's OP as DPS. You can get obscene mastery stacked bleeds during boss fights and big trash packs. I am surprised they haven't nerf'd the proc like they did for the Darkmoon trinkets.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Syo » Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:32 pm

It may be that I haven't run Dream of Cenarius all that often in CMs, as I opt for Heart of the Wild since there are a lot of areas you can use it to great effect, but I wasn't getting much benefit out of the very limited use of RoR.

I assumed with the vastly scaled down Ilvl of RoR, it suffered from a massive decrease in proc rate, is that not the case? Does it still retain the 522/528 proc rate, and simply receives a lower contribution since your stats are lower? If that's the case I could see RoR still being quite useful.

Also no I don't use Terror anymore as Feral, but I did have Terror/RoR tanking that change of command guy and laughed pretty hard at the outrageous crit percentage it put me at with both proc'd.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Apr 11, 2013 1:53 pm

I personally use HotW myself for all but a few of the runs. Hurricane is just to powerful to not use.

I finished all my CM golds on Sunday (months behind). As far as I could tell the proc rate is the same as it is in raids. I don't think the tool they use to scale down stats actually changes Ilvl which is what the RPPM rates are based on (your lowered haste will drop the rate some what). Now I will say that it does act just like in raids. It could be 2-3 minutes between procs (which sucks), or you could have 3 back to back to back procs in 1 boss fight. It was for me very effective, and did boost me enough to make me think using it is totally worth it.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Syo » Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:01 pm

Interesting regarding the proc for RoR, I had simply assumed (ignorantly) the Item scaling down affected the proc rate, since the varying Ilvls of the trinkets have different proc rates.

Congrats to finishing the CMs! My group is slowly working through them, but we've started to target golds since in doing some silvers we noticed ourselves very close to golds, and thought it more time efficient to simply target those over silvers.

Also yes HoTW is very useful in CMs from what I've used of it, HoTW Hurricane spam is enormous AoE damage at that gear level, and being able to HoTW Tranq and bomb heal a tank allows for some more reckless and expedient pulling.

For instance when we were doing Shado Pan Monastery gold just recently, I'd HoTW bomb heal our Bear who pulled the entire first room, for approximately 10-15 seconds, then drop a Hurricane on them and obliterate them in a few seconds, because hurricaning off the pull nearly always got me threat and killed.

*Sidenote* Our guild has a roster of 3 raiding Ferals (yes I know that's practically unheard of) and 2 of us use DoC, while the third just doesn't particularly like the process of using it, and sticks to HoTW (for wrath spam/hurricane aoe, and the passive over DoC), him and I have been discussing the potential of him still grabbing RoR, since he's been debating against it some and grabbing instead likely Renataki's Charm and Bad Juju. I'm pretty convinced still taking RoR and equalizing stats would be benficial for a HoTW build, does anyone happen to have the math for that?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Qualiti » Thu Apr 11, 2013 2:59 pm

While I've only had my RoR for two weeks or so I've gotten quite used to using it and I must say I really enjoy it. The DPS increase was immediate and substantial as far as maximizing I've grown accustomed for opening with something like:

Pre-pot ->Savage Roar(glyph) ->FF / auto attack ->RoR proc ->Rake ->Shred/mangle till 2-3 CP(depends on crit) ->Tigers Fury(Shred/mangle if needed.. most of the time it isnt) ->NS healing touch(DoC proc)
->Rake ->Rip ->Healing touch(DoC proc) ->Rake ->RoR falls
Berserk

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:17 pm

Qualiti wrote:Tigers Fury(Shred/mangle if needed.. most of the time it isnt) ->NS healing touch(DoC proc)

You should if at all possible never cast NS/HT after TF. Doing so will lose you at least 1.5 seconds of your TF (1 GCD for HT, and .5 to hit the NS macro twice) and likely energy cap you that early in the fight. You should cast your NS/HT macro at 4/5 combo points in your opener and then hit TF. Even if you run out of energy waiting 1 extra second for that last combo point is worth it. You will have enough time on Rune and SR to make this happen.

What I do is actually hit NS right after I hardcast my HT pre pull (just make sure the pull is really about to start). Remember the effect is your next HT is free/instant and in form. It has no time limit, and the cooldown starts as soon as you hit HT. This way you can save the .5 of having to hit your NS/HT macro twice in our rather hectic opener and just hit HT as soon as you have 4/5 combos.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Qualiti » Thu Apr 11, 2013 3:56 pm

Tinderhoof wrote:
Qualiti wrote:Tigers Fury(Shred/mangle if needed.. most of the time it isnt) ->NS healing touch(DoC proc)

You should if at all possible never cast NS/HT after TF. Doing so will lose you at least 1.5 seconds of your TF (1 GCD for HT, and .5 to hit the NS macro twice) and likely energy cap you that early in the fight. You should cast your NS/HT macro at 4/5 combo points in your opener and then hit TF. Even if you run out of energy waiting 1 extra second for that last combo point is worth it. You will have enough time on Rune and SR to make this happen.

What I do is actually hit NS right after I hardcast my HT pre pull (just make sure the pull is really about to start). Remember the effect is your next HT is free/instant and in form. It has no time limit, and the cooldown starts as soon as you hit HT. This way you can save the .5 of having to hit your NS/HT macro twice in our rather hectic opener and just hit HT as soon as you have 4/5 combos.


I TF to shred only if I dont crit one of the earlier abilties, sometimes I can get away with a clearcast or double crit first rake/shred. If I have to TF it's mostly to make the transition from start -> berserk as fast as possible to maximize procs/pot/ect pooling early can pose a problem. I'm not sure where I said I NS/HT before 4 combo points? I thought that was pretty clear. As far as the TF after the HT, ya you're absolutely right. It's one of those things I do in game, but when explaining it doesnt register the GCD in my mind.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby teddabear » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:15 am

Has anybody checked on reforging to 1:1:1 at lower gear levels? Currently at 507 ilvl with a 502 RoR. The principal seems the same unless the uptime decreases significantly.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Syo » Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:12 pm

teddabear wrote:Has anybody checked on reforging to 1:1:1 at lower gear levels? Currently at 507 ilvl with a 502 RoR. The principal seems the same unless the uptime decreases significantly.


Don't quote me on this but from what I remember, the Ilvls simply dictate proc percentage rate, and have no effect on the transfer of stats. A 502 RoR will transfer stats the same as a 541 HTF RoR, just less frequently, so reforging 1:1:1 should still be optimal for using it.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Qualiti » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:33 pm

Has anyone else noticed a pretty big difference in procs?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby aggixx » Wed Apr 17, 2013 9:54 pm

Yes, it's bugged right now. See this and this.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Steakbomb » Thu Apr 18, 2013 12:35 pm

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-q ... boss=68476

11 attempts last night and 57 procs

Seems fine to me but idk, only had it for a couple days
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Apr 18, 2013 1:51 pm

I had it from week 3 on. Up until Tuesday it would almost always proc on the pull. The bad luck streak code they put in should prevent it from not proc'ing for 5 minutes of a fight. Which is happening now. If you look at some of your pulls and not just night as a whole, you will see a few of them Rune doesn't proc for the first 3 minutes. What is really funny Steak is you did exactly what Blizzard did:
While there have been modifications to reduce the occurrence of unlucky streaks it is still hypothetically possible to get a bad run. The tests we've conducted in the current live build have the Rune of Re-origination proccing, on average, every 50-70 seconds.


But when forced to look at what was actually happening, and not just looking at the average:
Going a little deeper into logs and we are seeing something amiss. I'll update when I have more information.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Dysheki » Thu Apr 18, 2013 2:58 pm

Yeah, basically the only time I wasn't getting a proc on pull was for Tortos because of the ridiculously short runback. Kind of annoyed it took extra prodding for them to realize what we were saying. Oh well. I'll be heading back home shortly to check on it. I'm guessing it isn't something that can be hotfixed, but lets hope.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Syo » Thu Apr 18, 2013 6:28 pm

We were doing attempts on Heroic Horridon last night and of all of the attempts I only had it proc once at the start of the fight and each pull was at least ~3 minutes from wipe to initiation so the failsafe should have kicked in. The proc rate also felt very erratic as I would get 2-3 nearly on the timing of it coming off cooldown, then wouldn't see a proc for several minutes. At any rate hopefully it's something they can easily resolve.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:48 pm

Good news. I got Ghostcrawler to respond to a tweet regarding Rune:
Greg Street ‏@Ghostcrawler 7m
@Tinderhoof This is just a bug. We fixed it but it broke again. It will be fixed again next restarts.

Its a shame we are going to lose most of the raid week to this, but at least it should be fixed by tomorrow.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Kroníc » Thu Apr 18, 2013 7:57 pm

Sigh...Thank you Blizz for trying to fix RoR for hunters only to break it for everyone else.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Whitepaw » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:27 am

Balanced my secondary stats, but with Mastery being highest.

However, I have Windsong on my weapon. Let's say it procs 1500 Haste - and then RoR procs. Will it now be a Haste buff, as the proc from Windsong makes Haste the largest of the secondary stats.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby kerplunk101 » Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:49 am

Hey guys, just got the rune today, all reforged and set.

I would like to know what the reason we reforge 1.1.1. I know that upping haste will increase proc chance. So why dont we just have mastery and haste at 1.1 and completely ignore crit?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Fri Apr 19, 2013 4:09 am

Whitepaw wrote:Balanced my secondary stats, but with Mastery being highest.

However, I have Windsong on my weapon. Let's say it procs 1500 Haste - and then RoR procs. Will it now be a Haste buff, as the proc from Windsong makes Haste the largest of the secondary stats.

Yes and it will tank your dps when it does. You shouldn't have Windsong on your weapon anyway. Dancing Steel may be pricy, but its wroth it.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Fri Apr 19, 2013 4:15 am

kerplunk101 wrote:Hey guys, just got the rune today, all reforged and set.

I would like to know what the reason we reforge 1.1.1. I know that upping haste will increase proc chance. So why dont we just have mastery and haste at 1.1 and completely ignore crit?

The proc takes your 2 lower stats, adds them together and doubles them. If you have 10,000 total secondary stats, with Mastery at 5k, Haste at 4k, and crit at 1k, you have (4000 + 1000) * 2 = 10,000 extra Mastery. If however you have 4k Mastery 3k Haste, and 3k Crit you have (3000 + 3000) * 2 = 12k Mastery. The more of each seconday stat you have the larger the proc you will have.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Cetlysm » Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:00 pm

I can't decide which trinket to pair with RoR.
I got Renetaki 522, Bad JuJu 522 and enough vp for Vicious Talisman but I want to be near vp cap for when 5.3 comes out... so renataki appears to be the best combination according to some of the sims I've seen in this site.
But isn't rentaki's proc on pull or even mid fight too luck based to time correctly with the only RoR 10 sec duration? (Having a decent amount of stacks on renataki while ror procs)
But also if I use Vicious or Renataki best I can reforge is either 250 exp or hit above cap while JuJu obviously lets me reforge perfectly.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby raffy » Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:36 am

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby kerplunk101 » Sat Apr 20, 2013 8:19 am

Edit
Last edited by kerplunk101 on Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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