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Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby teddabear » Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:24 am

It still seems to be erratic for me. Could just be RNG but I have spent a ton of time on the training dummy in the past week, I'd say around 6 hours. What is really strange though is OoC is feast or famine, I've never seen it act like this. I'm getting 20% variation in my DPS on the training dummy, I don't I've ever gotten more than 5% in the past.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby aggixx » Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:36 am

If you mean +/- 10% that doesn't sound that outrageous to me, and I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary with OoC, I think you're probably overanalyzing ;)
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby feralminded » Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:00 pm

I have to admit I am not having a ton of fun with this trinket. When it procs I hit 30k mastery and bleeds do insane things but for those 10 seconds I am quivering in fear that my savage roar is gonna fall off or that some mechanic comes up that I HAVE to deal with and/or that I don't have enough energy to get up a rip for some random/dumb reason (0 haste energy gen and base crit feels awful for generating CPs). When the trinket works its amazing (over 30k mastery) but in highly variable fights with lots of "run away" mechanics (plenty of the heroics) I really feel like the trinket starts to fail hard. It's still completely awesome for execute range (be sure to line up your 2nd pot with TF and RoR for the super Rip of doom) assuming you are in a hard burn (most of the bosses facilitate this), but still we will have to see. I don't think it's fair to expect anywhere near simmed values for this one, at least not on heroics.

The upside is with the reforge my kitty gear has become significantly better for tanking (Guardians have little use for mastery).
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Cetlysm » Mon May 13, 2013 1:11 pm

Can I have a link to the secondary stats vs agility gemming with rune math someone did around here?
I can't decide if gemming for socket when the socket is orange or blue(while not wasting the hit from blue) and/or if the bonus is haste or crit would be worth it with a 528 rune.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Mon May 13, 2013 2:34 pm

I am pretty sure Aggixx did that by getting the stats for both methods and running it through SimC. You could do the same and find what those results would do for you.

If you are concerned going over the hit cap and the socket bonus for a blue gem produces more agility (like our tier legs and chest) gem the agi/stam cut. You still come out ahead on agility and the stam will actually be more useful then Hit over the cap.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby aggixx » Mon May 13, 2013 3:23 pm

Sure, this is the only documentation of the proccess I actually did: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1883&start=100#p16533

The difference between gemming pure secondaries + matching sockets, and gemming pure primaries + matching sockets, is almost completely negligible, and it doesn't seem that the item level of your rune has a strong effect on that result. Hence, the conclusion is that you should match all socket bonuses that don't give you useless stats (obviously don't match a stam socket bonus, don't match an all blue item if the hit is all overcap, etc).

Check out this graphical representation of the value of each combination of socket colors. The columns on the right side indicate whether or not, for the stat at the top of that column, the combination is worth matching (The number is the net gain/loss; green means gain, red means loss [Hint: There isn't any red]).
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby TagTheDruid » Thu May 16, 2013 4:28 am

Not sure if I just missed this, scanning through this thread or not, but as I'm aware of it, DoC is a decently higher dps if performed with the same efficiency as standard HoTW.

Does that change once you get RoR?
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby aggixx » Thu May 16, 2013 4:41 am

The relative difference is about the same.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Felucia » Mon May 20, 2013 3:40 pm

Hello fellow kittens :D
I've got a simple question, that may be hard to answer.
When 5.3 hits, will it be worth upgrading T15 set pieces, if you have the possibility of getting the heroic tf nonset pieces for all the slots? Do the Set bonusses outweigh the stat gain from thunderforged pieces?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Tinderhoof » Mon May 20, 2013 4:13 pm

Short answer: Yes.
Long answer: Losing a set bonus for a single TF'd item isn't going to be worth it. Now if in one night you got 4 TF'd 541 pieces that replaced all of your 502 LFR tier pieces it may be a plus. However if you are getting heroic TF'd items you have a shot at the tier as well (it will be better).

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Dysheki » Tue May 21, 2013 8:26 pm

If you upgrade your gear don't forget to check if you need to reforge.

Went through a fight with haste procs

: (
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby henrikw92 » Wed May 22, 2013 12:28 pm

Dysheki wrote:If you upgrade your gear don't forget to check if you need to reforge.

Went through a fight with haste procs

: (


Yeah, I was lucky to still have mastery as my highest stat, but I'm over hit and expertise cap, and my haste is a bit far behind my other stats.

And blizzard broke armory with the item upgrades, so I can't get my character into catus to do a new reforge -.-

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Dysheki » Wed May 22, 2013 9:58 pm

Download the latest Catus. It works now.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby teddabear » Tue Jun 04, 2013 4:43 am

I'm wondering if I am reading the sims right. It looks like any combination of Bad Juju, Rentaki's and RoR are within 1k of each other with RoR winning at the lower item level. However I am hearing anecdotes from other Ferals that it is more like 10k which seems hard to believe.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby aggixx » Tue Jun 04, 2013 2:39 pm

Depends on the average item level of the gear you're testing with. Rune is a strong competitor at the 502 & 522 levels but when you start getting to heroic raid levels of gear it really takes off compared to the other trinkets as the potency (and uptime) of the proc vastly increases.
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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Kakurenbo » Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:26 am

So running Catus on my druid atm

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/d ... o/advanced

following what it said exactly.

It claims I should be on the following.
Mastery: 7133
Crit: 7132
Haste: 7130
Expertise: 2699
Hit: 2552

yet when I do what it says in game The results are not at this conclusion whatsoever..
anyone have a clue?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Vami » Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:32 am

Kakurenbo wrote:So running Catus on my druid atm

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/d ... o/advanced

following what it said exactly.

It claims I should be on the following.
Mastery: 7133
Crit: 7132
Haste: 7130
Expertise: 2699
Hit: 2552

yet when I do what it says in game The results are not at this conclusion whatsoever..
anyone have a clue?


One reforge, one gem or one enchant wrong and it's enough to mess everything up. Relog, reforge again, minimize cost, and then use "compare to armory" to check what doesn't match. If that doesn't help, the Catus sticky topic is probably a better place to ask. :)

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Kakurenbo » Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:38 am

interestingly enough it wasn't actually telling me to reforge my belt and wrist.
So presumed it was to be left unreforged.
when I did the compare like you stated it showed these as being wrong.
I'm still fairly new to the program hehe.
Thank you very much Vami! ^_^

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Xenyon » Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:14 pm

Heya, longtime stalker and finally posting now :P

Got Rune a while ago, watched Aggixx video and used Catus to reforge.

Got to:
6053 Haste
5913 Crit
6099 Mastery
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/azshara/Xenyon/advanced

Any tips if I could do that a bit better or is it at close as I can get?

Thanks for everyones work here btw, dont know what i would do without you guys <3

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby raffy » Tue Jun 25, 2013 4:30 pm

If that reforge is from Catus, using Hit/Exp At-Least 2550, and you have Enchant Gloves/Cloak and Gems with Break Bonuses, you can be pretty sure that's the best possible reforge. The secondary breakdown does look a bit wide but your current armory is PvP gear so I can't check it. The default mastery overflow for Catus is 100 (I think) yet 6099 - 5913 = 186 so something seems off.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Xenyon » Tue Jun 25, 2013 5:20 pm

Oh sorry, im in PvE gear now.. ^^

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby raffy » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:55 pm

If you use Catus, you should be able to find a solution like this:
Stats: Hit: 2577, Expertise: 2550, Mastery: 6139, Haste: 6138, Crit: 6138
Deltas: -160 Agi, +225 Crit, -1 Expertise, +85 Haste, -69 Hit, +40 Mastery, +120 Stam

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby apoollon » Tue Jul 02, 2013 6:56 pm

Hey peeps! I had this interesting thought when i was testing trinkets combos at the dummies, here goes:
imagine you've just applied a pot+rune Bitw rip on your target, would it be a DPS gain if you swap your weapon(assuming the same ilvl weap, shifting the top 2ndary stat to crit/haste for more CP generation/ bigger fero bites/ more lengendary meta procs?

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby raffy » Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:23 pm

During BitW, it's much easier to maximize Rune procs since you can almost ways Rake within 1-second of the proc, and Rake again before the fade.

Throwing off your 1:1:1 balance with a weapon change seems crazy: it's adding a ton of complexity, for a gain that you probably can't even detect with a 100k+ iteration sim.

It's far more important to maximize your FF, SR, Rake, Rip, Thrash uptimes before doing anything else. There is far more to gain from proper execution than there is from tiny edge-case optimizations.

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Re: Maximizing Rune of Re-Origination

Postby Ungala » Wed Jul 24, 2013 12:14 am

Is the tooltip damage for RoRo bugged? I will hit a 5 CP Rip with RoRo up, and it shows some garbage number on the tooltip, something like 13k every tick, WITH the extra 30,000 mastery from RoRo.

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