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If someone has time to look at a log...

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If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Sibylle » Wed Sep 18, 2013 6:06 pm

Just as a reminder: I'm a "bleedin' casual", if a very fanatic one. So the following is actually "good" for me ;)

I'd much appreciate if you could look at one of my logs: Iron Juggernaut, tonight's kill.

My uptimes are ok (Rip could and should be even higher). I got high active time on the boss because he hardly knocked me back at all, I was with my back against a fence.

My question is, what could I do even better? Look at my dps versus that of the priest and pally. I think I can take them! Any hints?

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/Tialy/simple


P.S. I'm 11/12 Runestones, so nearly caught up! Looking forward to my cloak :D
-Sibylle

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby cg1351 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:06 am

You'll love the legendary my sim dps went from 220 to 244 and i can hold over 270 single target easy :D

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Tremnen » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:29 am

Nice damage. Really want to congratulate you on your trash uptime. ~80% is stellar.

Gear wise you need to ditch rune as soon as you find a normal mode agility trinket. Your raid finder one won't go that far. The cloak is going to be a stupid big upgrade over your current one. Be excited.

Only thing I would really recommend is making a macro for berserk berserking and tigers fury so they all get casted at the same time.

Nice work. You even had sub par rentak I procs.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Sibylle » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:53 am

D'awww, thank you :) And yeah, I can't wait to get the cloak - it'll be over 100 iLevels upgrade in that slot!

Not one single trinket has dropped so far, gaaah! Drops have been heavy on the plate and spirit-cloth side.

I usually align TF and Berserk, did I botch it in this fight? Gotta check the log again myself, it was very late last night. D'oh, that alone would probably have added a couple k dps.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby aggixx » Thu Sep 19, 2013 7:04 am

Your uptimes look good. On TF/Berserk: sometimes even if you use a macro they will show up in the combat log as being cast slightly staggered. If you're not using a macro you should get one though; there's just no reason not to have one because it makes things so much easier.

You shouldn't have used your second berserk and potion when you did, you want the potion to be up at some point during execute (early if possible) while you have trinket procs up so you can get a nice big rip going. This is also when you should use your Berserk (obviously you would only save it that long since you're never going to get more than 2 berserks in anyway). You probably should have used pot and Berserk with your second to last Rune proc, although there's always some degree of gambling to be done in what kind of procs you wait for before using your pot.

The amount of Rip clipping you're doing looks good, although it seems you aren't doing very well at using Rake for the direct damage during Rune because you only had 13 "spare" rake casts the whole fight (even though you had 10 Rune procs).
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Cetlysm » Thu Sep 19, 2013 12:32 pm

aggixx wrote:Your uptimes look good. On TF/Berserk: sometimes even if you use a macro they will show up in the combat log as being cast slightly staggered. If you're not using a macro you should get one though; there's just no reason not to have one because it makes things so much easier.

You shouldn't have used your second berserk and potion when you did, you want the potion to be up at some point during execute (early if possible) while you have trinket procs up so you can get a nice big rip going. This is also when you should use your Berserk (obviously you would only save it that long since you're never going to get more than 2 berserks in anyway). You probably should have used pot and Berserk with your second to last Rune proc, although there's always some degree of gambling to be done in what kind of procs you wait for before using your pot.

The amount of Rip clipping you're doing looks good, although it seems you aren't doing very well at using Rake for the direct damage during Rune because you only had 13 "spare" rake casts the whole fight (even though you had 10 Rune procs).

How do you even check clipping on WoL?
I'm at the Buffs cast section and clicked on the rip, rake, thrash #s but I don't know what I'm looking at.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Sibylle » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:02 pm

aggixx wrote:Your uptimes look good. On TF/Berserk: sometimes even if you use a macro they will show up in the combat log as being cast slightly staggered. If you're not using a macro you should get one though; there's just no reason not to have one because it makes things so much easier.

You shouldn't have used your second berserk and potion when you did, you want the potion to be up at some point during execute (early if possible) while you have trinket procs up so you can get a nice big rip going. This is also when you should use your Berserk (obviously you would only save it that long since you're never going to get more than 2 berserks in anyway). You probably should have used pot and Berserk with your second to last Rune proc, although there's always some degree of gambling to be done in what kind of procs you wait for before using your pot.

The amount of Rip clipping you're doing looks good, although it seems you aren't doing very well at using Rake for the direct damage during Rune because you only had 13 "spare" rake casts the whole fight (even though you had 10 Rune procs).

This is gold and makes so much sense. Thanks a bunch! The answer to both observations is that I use DroodFocus to track DoT power - that's why I know when to overwrite Rip but will only overwrite Rake once or until it's strong enough, because I actually don't track trinket procs (yet). I guess that'll be my next step.

Thanks again, I really appreciate it :)
-Sibylle

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby cg1351 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:10 pm

Unless droodfocus takes this into account i'd say ignore the stronger dot and spam the rake for increased damage over your mangle and then go for the rip and potentially another doc buffed rake at the end of the rune proc. The way i see it a normal rune rake with 15 seconds left is better then a doc rune rake with 5.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby cg1351 » Thu Sep 19, 2013 1:13 pm

While we're discussing dots can anyone tell me what sort of uptime i should be looking at for 550 ilvl? I checked a few logs and it's betwen 40-60% (maybe more if there's any cleave involved) but i see some people talking about 90%+ and it just doesn't always feel like i can keep thrash up like that atleast not without sacrificing something. I'd love to know if it is a dps increase to keep it up 100% of the time when possible.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Paloro » Thu Sep 19, 2013 4:23 pm

This is one of my Norushen attempts (logs apparently didn't capture the kill). This is 25m Heroic btw. I have 93.8, 99.2 and 93.3% uptimes on Rip, Rake and Thrash respectively. I was 553 itlvl for this fight.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby aggixx » Thu Sep 19, 2013 5:55 pm

Cetlysm wrote:How do you even check clipping on WoL?
I'm at the Buffs cast section and clicked on the rip, rake, thrash #s but I don't know what I'm looking at.

My doing some math by ability count and uptime. In the log in the OP, she had 38 rake direct hits and 6 minutes and 17 seconds of rake uptime. 6 mins 17 seconds is 377, divided by 15 is 25.133 rakes required to maintain that uptime. Hence, she had 193 seconds of clipped Rake or 12.867 Rakes. Now most of the time you're not clipping a full 15 seconds when you cast a new Rake but it's still a good statistic for comparisons' sake.

You can also look at average bleed duration, take the uptime and divide it by the number of applications and compare those. For Rip you have to look at expression editor to get specifics, but she had 15 rip applications not including execute for a total duration of 244 seconds which means her average Rip duration pre-execute was 16.29 seconds. This also gives you an idea of how much bleed clipping was done (although Rip extensions play into this to some degree as well).
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby cg1351 » Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:21 am

Paloro wrote:This is one of my Norushen attempts (logs apparently didn't capture the kill). This is 25m Heroic btw. I have 93.8, 99.2 and 93.3% uptimes on Rip, Rake and Thrash respectively. I was 553 itlvl for this fight.


The log says 25 man normal and the dps looks really low for that level of gear. Need someone's advice on optimal thrash uptime single target.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Taraan » Fri Sep 20, 2013 2:22 am

The log says 25 man normal and the dps looks really low for that level of gear. Need someone's advice on optimal thrash uptime single target.


World of Logs doesn't detect difficulties (yet?), so even though it says 25N it can be heroic. Norushen also takes reduced damage due to the corruption boss mechanic, 220k on Norushen zerg tactic is pretty good. dps.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Helistar » Fri Sep 20, 2013 4:25 am

Paloro wrote:This is one of my Norushen attempts (logs apparently didn't capture the kill). This is 25m Heroic btw. I have 93.8, 99.2 and 93.3% uptimes on Rip, Rake and Thrash respectively. I was 553 itlvl for this fight.


You only have 7 FB cast during the entire fight..... it makes it a whole lot easier to keep high DoT uptimes if you manage your CPs that way.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Stenhaldi » Fri Sep 20, 2013 7:34 am

Thrash is better than ferocious bite -- same damage and energy cost but no combo point cost.

I typically have ~70% uptime on single-target thrash though. While you can do better without hurting your raw rip/rake/roar uptimes, what you start to lose is your uptime on trinket-buffed rip, as casting thrash at low CP can leave you in a bad position if a trinket procs shortly after.

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Helistar » Fri Sep 20, 2013 8:46 am

Stenhaldi wrote:Thrash is better than ferocious bite -- same damage and energy cost but no combo point cost.


My napkin math must be wrong, I was getting the opposite. Very wrong, as my logs confirm it as well, on our Malkorok kill my thrash DPEx is way higher than FB, even if the DPE with SotF puts FB ahead of thrash. I must go back to the good habits of dot uptime and stop FBing like mad, it seems :)

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Paloro » Fri Sep 20, 2013 10:54 am

Taraan wrote:
The log says 25 man normal and the dps looks really low for that level of gear. Need someone's advice on optimal thrash uptime single target.


World of Logs doesn't detect difficulties (yet?), so even though it says 25N it can be heroic. Norushen also takes reduced damage due to the corruption boss mechanic, 220k on Norushen zerg tactic is pretty good. dps.


That is correct, WoL doesn't detect heroics just yet. We were able to do the zerg strat and not send any dps down.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Whitepaw » Fri Sep 20, 2013 11:30 am

I suggest getting Force of Nature - I believe it will be a non-trivial dps increase :D

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Cetlysm » Fri Sep 20, 2013 1:06 pm

Whitepaw wrote:I suggest getting Force of Nature - I believe it will be a non-trivial dps increase :D

Except when they spawn in front of the boss and get parried, maybe that's boss size dependent but I seen it happen at least twice on 1 fight.
Are they ever gonna fix that?
I guess they did fix the range problem with primal fury but its still delayed as hell.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby aggixx » Fri Sep 20, 2013 5:30 pm

Cetlysm wrote:
Whitepaw wrote:I suggest getting Force of Nature - I believe it will be a non-trivial dps increase :D

Except when they spawn in front of the boss and get parried, maybe that's boss size dependent but I seen it happen at least twice on 1 fight.
Are they ever gonna fix that?
I guess they did fix the range problem with primal fury but its still delayed as hell.


It's a DPS gain even accounting for that, and it happens rare enough you're probably not going to get super RNGd and have half your rakes parried or w/e.

But I wouldn't recommend using it to someone who's explicitly asking for help with their DPS. It's not going to be a gain if you're sitting on 3 charges for sometime and not using them with your procs effectively. It's also harder and there's many other things that an improving player can pay attention to for much more significant DPS gains.
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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Sibylle » Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:34 pm

So... I BEAT THEM 8-)

We downed Siegecrafter Blackfuse today, and will you just look at this?
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/0x0vef76vlh7enjk/sum/damageDone/?s=11018&e=11339
Ok, with the priest it wasn't fair really, as he was on conveyor belt duty - but the pally! Mwahahaha!

And yes, I know it's far too early in the tier to be relevant in the slightest, but it still makes me a very happy kitty:
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Thank you so much, aggixx and all, you guys were spot-on and you rock.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'll have to tab back out and grin at my uptimes for another while.
-Sibylle

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby CuTtLeD » Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:41 pm

Where is that table from, tool inside WoL? And Good Work!!
“Journalist:
Congressman Kucinich, I believe you're the only one here who voted against the PATRIOT act right away after 9/11. Why is that?

His Reply:
Because I read it.”

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby Sibylle » Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:43 pm

CuTtLeD wrote:Where is that table from, tool inside WoL? And Good Work!!

Thank you :) As for the table: If you click the link I posted, and then mouse over the "Damage Done" menu, the bottom option there is "Rankings Info".
-Sibylle

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Re: If someone has time to look at a log...

Postby CuTtLeD » Mon Sep 23, 2013 6:45 pm

Aha much appreciated:)
“Journalist:
Congressman Kucinich, I believe you're the only one here who voted against the PATRIOT act right away after 9/11. Why is that?

His Reply:
Because I read it.”

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