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Edgy/Raffy's Catus Thread (Not 6.0 Ready Yet)

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:30 pm

I was going to suggest holding down [alt] when you click Import, as this will bypass the armory cache, but I suspect the actual problem is that Catus caches player-to-realm search results for 24 hours (and there's no easy way to circumvent it.)

You'll have to specify the realm manually, enter "Dodok Eredar!" and it should import. This should fix itself by tomorrow.

You could also go into the "Cache" folder and delete "eu.battle.net" and try searching for "Dodok" again (you can do this while Catus is running.)

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Dodok » Fri Oct 25, 2013 6:23 pm

raffy wrote:I was going to suggest holding down [alt] when you click Import, as this will bypass the armory cache, but I suspect the actual problem is that Catus caches player-to-realm search results for 24 hours (and there's no easy way to circumvent it.)

You'll have to specify the realm manually, enter "Dodok Eredar!" and it should import. This should fix itself by tomorrow.

You could also go into the "Cache" folder and delete "eu.battle.net" and try searching for "Dodok" again (you can do this while Catus is running.)


Manually entering the realm and forcing the import worked. Thanks a lot.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Dodok » Sat Oct 26, 2013 4:52 am

I think I found something you may overlooked:

I am running on an german OS and therefore my JVM runs a german locale by default so decimals are shown as 1.234.567,89 oposed to the english locale which would display 1,234,567.89 instead. This causes the default stat weights to be 6,50 for agi instead of 6.50 which consequently leads to Catus rejecting it as it is not a number. Further down the road I think that is the cause for me being unable to generate stat weights as it seems to run for some milliseconds and than silently fails.

If I remeber my Java correctly simply setting the global numbers locale to enUS during start up of Catus should fix this.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Sat Oct 26, 2013 7:10 am

New update soon. I've got the following ready and I'm working on a few more things.
- localized number parsing
- simulator: weights has better error calculations
- simulator: weights has csv export
- simulator: weights can run random deltas for external analysis
- can easily copy just gear or just settings from another configuration
- new simulator: compare for quick comparison
- one-click armory compare and one-click configuration compare
- in "Fixed Iteration" mode, it works like old AvsB
- in "Check Upgrade" mode, simulation runs until better/worse can be statistically established with high confidence (very fast)
- in "Quantify Upgrade" mode, simulation runs until both runs are stable and joint error is below some threshold (like 250 DPS)
- can choose either "Share Settings" (different gear + current settings), "Use Recommended Settings" (different gear + default settings/encounter w/o overwriting existing settings), or "Separate Configuration Settings" (different gear, different settings, different encounters)
- armory import cache override now includes search data too

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby CóladaEU » Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:35 pm

Just to be sure, can you use Catus for reforging/gemming without having RoR?

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Sat Oct 26, 2013 5:08 pm

Yea, "Maximize Secondary" tab in "Reforge" panel (I guess it should say Maximize Stat). It works like 1:1:1 Reforger except it uses Stat Weights. It is guaranteed optimal (it is exhaustive) relative to the specified stats weights and hit/exp constraints.

Image
Special has shortcuts for "HotW vs DoC", "SotF vs FoN", "Self vs Raid Buffed", etc...
Configurations has all other configurations (skipping the current one)
Armory lets you fight against your live gear.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Cyc » Sat Oct 26, 2013 8:33 pm

Not sure if its my comp, but each time I try to load catus it just freezes at loading 677 gear. I downloaded the most recent update as well and still the same issue.


Edit: I let it run and it finished but took a long time. more than 8 minutes to complete. maybe I need to re-download it.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Sat Oct 26, 2013 10:54 pm

How long does it take now that it has completed the download once?

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Andasta » Sun Oct 27, 2013 3:54 pm

I just wanted to say the trinket simulator has given catus my vote for most useful third party app all time, thanks for your work.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:57 am

Thanks :)

Catus 29 should be ready tonight:
Image

GSO!!! :p
Image

I've added "Worgen vs Troll" to one of the premade Quick Compare's (you do this currently in Catus by just starting 2 separate sims, one for each race) and noticed that Worgen appears to be the best Feral race (for non-Beast encounters obviously.) Possibly Berserking needs some optimization, maybe coupling it w/Berserk is it wasted and instead should be used during a double-trinket proc or something.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Mon Oct 28, 2013 5:22 am

Released Catus v29.
Primary goal of this update was to fix the localization+parsing issues and restore AvsB-style comparisons.
- localized number parsing
- simulator: weights has better error calculations (needed joint error)
- simulator: weights has csv export w/ random deltas for external analysis
- simulator: weights are relative to expected delta (using sign)
- can easily copy just gear from another configuration (copy menu in equip panel)
- new simulator: quick compare
- one-click armory compare
- one-click configuration compare
- one-click "special" compare, includes a bunch of interesting comparisons
- in "Fixed Iteration" mode, it works like old AvsB
- both "Detect Upgrade" and "Quantify Upgrade" modes are disabled (not happy with the statistics)
- can choose either "Use Current" (different gear + current settings), "Use Recommended" (different gear + default settings/encounter w/o overwriting existing settings), or "Use Configuration" (different gear, different settings, different encounters)
- armory import cache override now includes search data too
- simulator: trinkets "advanced mode" can populate from basic checkboxes ("Import from Selected"), hold [alt] to edit directly
- changed display for one-handed weapons (not as wide)
- added more tooltips

Hopefully, I didn't break anything. I've been restructuring a bunch of code to make it easier to "fork a simulator" based on the loaded settings. Each simulator object is now fully contained (includes all gear, settings, and encounter information), and functions like an iterator, so it's possible to "weave" two simulators in the same thread like a coroutine:
Code: Select all
FeralSim simA = ...;
FeralSim simB = ...;
for (int i = 0; i < 10; i++) {
   simA.runOnce();
   simB.runOnce();
}

I haven't fixed this issue yet: "Simc: X%" variance-mode
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4574&start=725#p20140
Nor looked any further into: "4pc w/NoRune/HotW/FoN/AoC"
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=4574&start=750#p20193
Additionally, it appears that Worgen > Troll -- does that make sense? I'll pull some WoL data again soon, and I'll check for Race.

"Simulator: Quick Compare" is still very basic. I need to improve the statistical methods that allow it to automatically terminate and/or determine if the two simulators are the same or different. Also, it only has "Stat" information for a limited number of things. I will expand this more once I've figured out a better way to discover these differences without hand-coding them.

The localized number parsing thing is untested. It should parse under the proper locale now. Unfortunately, the "7.5%" defaults are not localized (I'll fix this in a future update.)

I've been asked about emulating non-stationary fights. I think a simple way to model movement is to add a random, high-frequency periodic intermission, something like:
[x] Periodic Intermission: Frequency (10-15) Duration (2) Limit (blank)
Note: an intermission does not pause damage, it just pauses the action list.

Future plans include:
- better quick compare modes
- super down-scaling (include gems/enchants)
- upgrade/batch simulator
- aggregated simulator statistics (combat log stats x iteration)
- encounter: sequence
- more encounter script stuff (% based triggers, more commands, tutorial)

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Shibumi » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:50 pm

Hi again! I do terribly apologize for just popping in to ask for stuff, but I suppose it can't be helped :).

I've just hit the 79% crit soft cap in my tanking gear and I'm looking at the prospect of trying to figure out exactly how to reforge around that. The problem is that the reforge needs to be looking at the resulting crit percentage, taking into account bear form and raid buffs. I'm just not even sure how to try to do that either manually (just fudge around til it's close?) or automatically (sites allow me to specify an additional cap, but it bases it off of base armory stats which means I'd have to do reverse math and blah blah).

So, would something like this be currently possible or is something like this maybe easy to add in?

ilu guys!
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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Tempo » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:58 pm

thanks for bringing back the quick comparison... am thoroughly enjoying the new added functionality of it as well
Image

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Tue Oct 29, 2013 1:52 am

@Shibumi, I don't know your armory so I can't play with it.

I'm experimenting with "[x] Enforce Crit Cap for Guardians", which becomes visible when Bear form is selected in Cat Stats.
Image

This is the improvement it gives to Arielle's gear:
Code: Select all
Reforges (208g 2s): 7 differences
               Head: None                                     => Haste > Expertise
               Neck: Haste > Expertise                        => Critical Strike > Hit
           Shoulder: None                                     => Hit > Haste
              Chest: None                                     => Haste > Expertise
              Waist: Haste > Expertise                        => Hit > Critical Strike
           Finger 1: Mastery > Critical Strike                => Mastery > Expertise
          Main Hand: Mastery > Expertise                      => Mastery > Critical Strike

Enchants: 0 differences

Sockets: 2 differences
        Waist/Bonus: None                                     => +120 Agility
     Finger 1/Bonus: +60 Crit                                 => None

Gems: 3 differences
        Waist/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
        Waist/Gem#2: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Piercing Wild Jade
     Finger 1/Gem#1: Crafty Vermilion Onyx                    => Piercing Wild Jade

Stats: 5 differences
            Agility: -120 Agi                                 => +120 Agi
    Critical Strike: -97 Crit                                 => +97 Crit
          Expertise: +106 Expertise                           => -106 Expertise
              Haste: -55 Haste                                => +55 Haste
                Hit: +106 Hit                                 => -106 Hit

Edit: improved it, got enchants working properly.
Edit: I've been modeling the Worgen "Viciousness" bonus as "+600 Inert Crit Rating", I suspect that is incorrect?
Edit: ok I fixed that, and I got it so it respects your talents and stuff. It's pretty OP actually, works surprisingly well.

I've been using these settings (pulled the weights out of my ass):
Image
If you drop the crit threshold to an achievable crit, it should be able to satisfy it very closely.
I tested Arielle's gear from 60% to 74%.

Give it a try: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/298 ... earHax.zip (Based on v29)

Instructions:
1. Import your Druid
2. Make sure your talents are correct (Catus will grab your Cat talents if they exist)
3. Go to "Cat Stats" panel, click "Bear form"
4. Setup your buffs/consumables! (or click "Encounters" > "Use Recommended Effects")
5. Go to "Reforge" panel, click "Maximize Secondary", enter weights like above.

Warning: this is completely untested -- I only have 1 druid, Edgy on Suramar, and the realm is down.

Additionally, I made it so you can paste an armory URL into the import field, and it should be able to extract the Name, Realm, and Region. This will make it into the official v30 release during the next update. I also I fixed a few things in the Maximize Reforger, so it is faster and access to more gems.

Edit: lastly, inert stat weights are slightly wrong in this version. They are fine in the official v29 release however.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Alteredbeast » Tue Oct 29, 2013 11:01 am

Hi, I'm sure this is somewhere in here but I'm having trouble finding it. How do I export a reforge from cactus to a reforge addon. I currently use reforge lite so if you could tell me how to do it for that one I'd appreciate it. If not just tell me what addon to use and how to import my data. Thank you kindly
Image

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby inferiorlol » Tue Oct 29, 2013 12:54 pm

raffy wrote:Can you download and launch this application from the two locations you're using and copy/screenshot me the results?
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/298 ... n8Test.zip


Sorry for late response. I was away travelling. Anyway here are the results. Above is from explorer and below is from the search function.

Image

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Tue Oct 29, 2013 2:07 pm

Alteredbeast wrote:Hi, I'm sure this is somewhere in here but I'm having trouble finding it. How do I export a reforge from cactus to a reforge addon. I currently use reforge lite so if you could tell me how to do it for that one I'd appreciate it. If not just tell me what addon to use and how to import my data. Thank you kindly

Catus supports:
Reforgerade: http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/reforgerade
AskMrRobot:: http://www.curse.com/addons/wow/askmrrobot

Does ReforgeLite have an import method?

I recommend Reforgerade. Once you install it and reforge in Catus, click "Reforgerade" to get the reforging code to paste into Reforgerade at a Reforger guy in-game. Use "Shopping List" to figure out what to buy/change for enchants/gems/tinkers/upgrades.

If you're using the 1:1:1 reforger, remember to hit "Minimize Cost" before you export and starting making changes. This will search for other combinations that produce the same numerical result, but incur less overall adjustments.

---

@inferiorlol
That appears to be some kind of Windows 8 bug. It's launching Catus, but not telling me it where it's launching it from. Catus probably doesn't have privileges to write shit into System32, which explains why it redownloads stuff.

You could try making a shortcut for Catus, and launching that from the search.
You'll have to customize it slightly:
- you actually want to make a shorcut to java: C:\Windows\System32
- change "Start In" to the path to Catus directory: C:\Users\Kristoffer\Downloads\Catus-Latest
- you can apply the Catus icon to this shortcut for lulz

Edit: additionally, I updated the Win8Tester to v2, can you download and run it again?
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/298 ... n8Test.zip

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Shibumi » Tue Oct 29, 2013 10:43 pm

Holy shit, man. I will get on that directly as soon as I have a moment at home. Thanks! My armory is http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/s ... omi/simple since you asked.

EDIT: I went through really quick and clicked Reforge after all of that. It didn't finish the progress bar, and eventually just closed ... I can't remember, should something come up after that bar? It got to about 1/3 through. I'm not sure how to tell if ... well, I compared it to the armory. The reforges don't appear to have changed.

I put these values in: https://gist.github.com/nazrhyn/850a805357aa899e2de3

Maybe it didn't like the zeroes for Agi/Str/AP, but I didn't want it even considering those for enchants or anything. The priority is Crit@79% > Haste > Mastery.
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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Wed Oct 30, 2013 12:12 am

The bar should go by 3-4 times:
1. to reconfirm your latest armory
2. to check for hit/exp
3. to check finding the best solution
4. it might do a barber pole when sorting the solutions

I see a few issues, I'll update this post in a bit.

Edit: Damn, that was a pain in the ass to find. The Talisman of Bloodlust trinket, which Feral's don't use, was fucking things up. But it ended up being a bug in my reforger, which impacts both 1:1:1 and Maximize.

It also respects your Food and Flask now.

Here is what it suggests for your gear @ 79%, with 300/1000 Agi Food (maybe Bear's don't use Agi..)
Code: Select all
Hit: 2552, Expertise: 5106, Mastery: 3068, Haste: 9678, Crit: 17605

Bear Crit: 79.00% (+26407)

Gear: 0 differences

Reforges (116g 60s 87c): 5 differences
               Neck: Mastery > Critical Strike                => Mastery > Haste
           Shoulder: Haste > Critical Strike                  => Expertise > Critical Strike
              Wrist: None                                     => Expertise > Haste
              Hands: Mastery > Haste                          => Mastery > Expertise
               Legs: None                                     => Expertise > Haste

Enchants: 1 difference
              Hands: Enchant Gloves - Superior Expertise      => Enchant Gloves - Greater Haste

Sockets: 2 differences
        Chest/Bonus: None                                     => +180 Agility
        Hands/Bonus: None                                     => +120 Agility

Gems: 5 differences
        Chest/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
        Chest/Gem#2: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
        Chest/Gem#3: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
        Hands/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx
    Main Hand/Gem#1: Smooth Sun's Radiance                    => Crafty Vermilion Onyx

Stats: 4 differences
            Agility: -300 Agi                                 => +300 Agi
    Critical Strike: +1222 Crit                               => -1222 Crit
          Expertise: +1 Expertise                             => -1 Expertise
              Haste: -1223 Haste                              => +1223 Haste


Fixed Catus w/Bear Hax:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/298 ... earHax.zip
(and fixed inert stat weights, proper worgen crit, and armory import via url)

Edit: It's probably reducing the gems too much. It's only considering gem types with Crit on them due to the weights, since they score the best when Break bonuses is enabled, but with a Crit ceiling, it would be worth it to use possibly use gems with Haste.

If I enable all of the appropriate gems, it probably takes 10+ minutes to reforge. While it's relatively straight forward to write a direct reforger specific to Guardian needs, it is outside the scope of Catus. There's probably isn't an elegant way to find a global optimum efficiently. You could probably approximate it by slowly injecting replacing yellow Crit gems with Haste gems and locking the slot.

If I relax the gems, it takes wayyyy longer for very minor improvements:
Code: Select all
            Agility: -300 Agi                                 => +300 Agi
    Critical Strike: +1222 Crit                               => -1222 Crit
          Expertise: +6 Expertise                             => -6 Expertise
              Haste: -1228 Haste                              => +1228 Haste
            Mastery: -60 Mastery                              => +60 Mastery


Edit: unfortunately, the encoded configuration code doesn't include non-specific configuration stuff (Reforger, Regemer, most global settings, etc..) so I don't know what weights you used. That said, it's probably incorrect to assume that Agility is bad. Without assuming anything, it is at least worth 40% of what Crit is, since raid buffed in Bear, it's like 400 Crit Rating per 1% Crit and ~1000 Agility per 1% Crit. And that ignores the additional gain in AP and Dodge.

I can add another checkbox that enables access to more gems at the cost of significantly increased reforge time. Typically enabling this option is only necessary if you exceed the Crit cap w/o the maximum crit bound enabled.

Oh, and I finally got it to do the weird abort thing you described after testing it on a few different Windows machines. I'm looking into that now. Yep, throwing an OutOfMemoryError (Heap Space) exception. This exception can be thrown anywhere and typically avalanches into strange behavior. It's probably accumulating too many duplicate but equally good solutions. Until I can fix this, you'll need to launch Catus via command line:
1. cd to Catus directory
2. "java -Xmx1g -jar Catus.jar"

Edit: Yep, the Maximize Reforger priority queue is unbounded so it retains all the solutions it finds until it blows up. It looks like another temporary solution is reducing the Range to a very small number, like "5"

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby inferiorlol » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:27 am

raffy wrote:Edit: additionally, I updated the Win8Tester to v2, can you download and run it again?
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/298 ... n8Test.zip


Sure, results:

Image

I also get some graphic glitches when using the menus. I made a video of it (increase quality of video in youtube to see anything):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faFfcZ5Y ... e=youtu.be

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:45 pm

That last screenshot indicates that I can probably make it so Catus can find it's root directory, regardless of how it gets launched, which should avoid any strange jar-launching issues.

In regards to that video, I have no idea. Catus uses the standard Java Swing library for UI stuff and goes to great lengths making the UI thread-safe. Additionally, the scrolled content is double-buffered.

When is Catus having that problem? All the time? Only after a popup menu is shown?
Does it occur regardless of where it is launched from? (Open jar directly or via Search)
Does the Catus folder contain any error dumps? "hs_err_pidXYZ"

Can you open a cmd and run "java -version"?

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Ragadish » Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:45 pm

I remember having similar issues as those in the video in Windows 7 when I had Mumble running while using Catus. Haven't had any issues in Windows 8.1, if that helps in any way.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby inferiorlol » Wed Oct 30, 2013 6:23 pm

raffy wrote:That last screenshot indicates that I can probably make it so Catus can find it's root directory, regardless of how it gets launched, which should avoid any strange jar-launching issues.

In regards to that video, I have no idea. Catus uses the standard Java Swing library for UI stuff and goes to great lengths making the UI thread-safe. Additionally, the scrolled content is double-buffered.

When is Catus having that problem? All the time? Only after a popup menu is shown?
Does it occur regardless of where it is launched from? (Open jar directly or via Search)
Does the Catus folder contain any error dumps? "hs_err_pidXYZ"

Can you open a cmd and run "java -version"?


The post about Mumble led me to believe it is some bug with programs that tries to hook into applications with graphics and show an overlay. I had one program like that which is MSI Afterburner (more specifically RivaTunerStatisticsServer). When I have MSI Afterburner running it messes up like I showed you. As soon as the popup menu is clicked the UI scrambles on mouse movement. If I close MSI Afterburner everything goes back to normal.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby raffy » Wed Oct 30, 2013 6:37 pm

I take it you run the 32bit WoW client? The MSI OSD doesn't appear to work with 64bit applications. There are lots of people that play Minecraft that are forced to run 32bit Java when using MSI software.

You can download a 32bit Java runtime here: http://java.com/en/download/manual.jsp
If you go this route, you'll need to either: make the 32bit JRE your default or start Catus using a shortcut that invokes the 32bit JRE explicitly.

I know Java isn't the most elegant environment for native-ish applications, but it only requires 0.001% of my Catus development time to achieve Mac/Windows/Linux compatibility, which is a huge win. A more elegant solution would be moving to the browser and rewriting Catus in javascript. Maybe for the next expansion.

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Re: Edgy/Raffy's Official Catus Thread

Postby Shibumi » Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:56 pm

I can only imagine you must really like these puzzles :). Thanks for all the time.

To me, it has always seemed that once I reached >79% crit, while raid buffed, that I should just alter reforges first, while leaving gems at straight crit until it wasn't possible to reduce my crit anymore via reforging. I suppose that would be an easier question to ask, and could be asked by just unchecking the enchant and gem boxes and leaving it to just change stuff around with reforges only.

It would be fine to just overwrite the JAR while leaving all the cache files, yes? Also, since I see the 1g in that command switch, is that giving the runtime more memory to work with?

You're probably right about Agility, but in terms of reaching 79%, crit is the most effective. In terms of shifting crit to haste beyond that mark, I'm not sure I want to use Agility as a half-measure to improve the gradient, you know? I'd rather have bigger variance than over-math it like that. What do you think?
Shiboomi of <Riot> on US-Sargeras

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