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Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

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Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Wed Nov 30, 2011 4:49 pm

******************************************************************************************************************************
As 4.3 is over and we are moving on to MoP I am locking this thread. After the first week or two when WoL's catches up we can get a new thread going here. Thanks for everyone who contibuted during 4.3.
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Hey everyone. I am starting the new thread here just for 4.3. I am very pleased with how well the pervious thread went. Folks got helped, I personally learned plenty, and we kept the thread very positive. All good things.

The reason I am starting up the new thread is the pervious one while awesome may contain several tips/tricks/strats that may no longer be valid, or optimal due to nerfs, buffs, or mechanic changes (or I was just plain wrong). I was also hoping to create a little bit of a template to help those of us looking at the provided logs to get all of the information we need to help.

For assistance with 4.3 encounters please provide the following:
Link to Armory: <An advanced link is appreciated>
Link to Log(s): <Link as many logs as you like here>
Description: <Let us know what you would like assistance with>

It's ok if you just want help with gearing. You don't have to add logs, but it helps. Thanks everyone for making the first thread a success. Let’s make this new one just as good.
-Tinderhoof

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Kasprodeth » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:33 pm

Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/g ... z/advanced
Log: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k28iufm44ov2l927/
Tear it apart, lol. I know my rip/rake/sr uptimes were kinda bad on some of the fights. For some reason Ultraxion didnt upload. As a note, on Zon'ozz i decided to save my berserk for the first time we went into the stack phase instead of popping it off the start. It worked out to be up just after the 3rd time we went into the phase as well. Im not sure if this is going to be a dps gain or not, next week im gonna try it popping it off the pull. And we didnt have melee haste for any of these :cry:

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby shinryu » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:39 pm

Since the old thread got locked without a response, re-posting question:

So, how does the new Arrow of Time drop from the End Time dungeon (378 ilvl, 383 agil with 1149 haste proc for 20 seconds) compare to reg APS? I'm guessing the Arrow would probably be worth about the same as The Hungerer, and I just generally dislike on-use trinkets, but I never knew if The Hungerer beat out APS...would it be hunting for and replacing APS with Arrow of Time? And before you ask, yes Rag's been a bitch, haven't seen Matrix at all on my druid and my rogue lost the roll for it twice >.>

My other trinket is H Hungerer btw, so currently using it and reg APS.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:36 pm

Kasprodeth wrote:Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/g ... z/advanced
Log: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-k28iufm44ov2l927/
Tear it apart, lol. I know my rip/rake/sr uptimes were kinda bad on some of the fights. For some reason Ultraxion didnt upload. As a note, on Zon'ozz i decided to save my berserk for the first time we went into the stack phase instead of popping it off the start. It worked out to be up just after the 3rd time we went into the phase as well. Im not sure if this is going to be a dps gain or not, next week im gonna try it popping it off the pull. And we didnt have melee haste for any of these :cry:

Hey Kasprodeth.

Really not much to tear apart. When you are still learning the fights it's pretty hard to plan for max dps. About Ultraxion I don't think anyones logs worked, I know ours didn't. Based on everything I looked at I think your rip/rake up times were pretty good for learning. You could have done a little better with Savage Roar on Morchok. It looked like it dropped about 10 seconds before the first black ooze. Other then that you did fine.

A few things to think about in regards to Berserk planning. If you look at your first 5 kills they are all under 6 minutes. This gives you only 2 shots at berserk. On Zon'ozz when you put off berserk you miss out on your pre pot, and your Seed buff. If you look at the difference between the damage done by the first Berserk when you only had the TF buff, and the second Berserk when you had a pot and Seed active it's huge. For the time being I wouldn't hold back your Berserk at the start so you can make as much use of the available burst damage at the start as you can.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Thu Dec 01, 2011 3:40 pm

shinryu wrote:Since the old thread got locked without a response, re-posting question:

So, how does the new Arrow of Time drop from the End Time dungeon (378 ilvl, 383 agil with 1149 haste proc for 20 seconds) compare to reg APS? I'm guessing the Arrow would probably be worth about the same as The Hungerer, and I just generally dislike on-use trinkets, but I never knew if The Hungerer beat out APS...would it be hunting for and replacing APS with Arrow of Time? And before you ask, yes Rag's been a bitch, haven't seen Matrix at all on my druid and my rogue lost the roll for it twice >.>

My other trinket is H Hungerer btw, so currently using it and reg APS.

Hey Shinryu.

According to the math Yawining and Miir have put togther APS and Heroic Hungerer are coming out on top of Arrow of Time.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby shinryu » Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:23 pm

Tinderhoof wrote:
shinryu wrote:Since the old thread got locked without a response, re-posting question:

So, how does the new Arrow of Time drop from the End Time dungeon (378 ilvl, 383 agil with 1149 haste proc for 20 seconds) compare to reg APS? I'm guessing the Arrow would probably be worth about the same as The Hungerer, and I just generally dislike on-use trinkets, but I never knew if The Hungerer beat out APS...would it be hunting for and replacing APS with Arrow of Time? And before you ask, yes Rag's been a bitch, haven't seen Matrix at all on my druid and my rogue lost the roll for it twice >.>

My other trinket is H Hungerer btw, so currently using it and reg APS.

Hey Shinryu.

According to the math Yawining and Miir have put togther APS and Heroic Hungerer are coming out on top of Arrow of Time.

Darn...and that's reg APS right?

Oh well, least I know not to bother on the druid...rogue on the other hand...

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Ledgeby » Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:57 am

Hey guys
Just wondering about trinkets for next week. At the moment i'm rolling with 378 APS and 384 Matrix. Should I buy the VP trinket when I have enough next week or go for the Necklace? Here's my armoury link http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/b ... eby/simple
Cheers yet again for your help :)

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:42 pm

Taken from Yawnings/tangedyn's/Mihir's 4.3 trinket ratings:

Vial of Shadows (E410), Wrath of Unchaining (E416)
Vial of Shadows (E397)
Wrath of Unchaining (E403)
Vial of Shadows (E384)
Wrath of Unchaining (E390), Starcatcher Compass (E410)
Starcatcher Compass (E397)
Kiroptyric Sigil, Matrix Restabilizer (E397)
Matrix Restabilizer (E384), Starcatcher Compass (E384), Ancient Petrified Seed, The Hungerer (E391)

Personally I don't like on use trinkets for the most part. While they give you amazing burst, if you can't use them on cooldown they can fall behind. This is only my opinion. Plenty of folks have been able to make the on use trinkets work very well for them (ie your mileage may vary).

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Leafkiller » Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:36 pm

Tinderhoof wrote:Personally I don't like on use trinkets for the most part. While they give you amazing burst, if you can't use them on cooldown they can fall behind. This is only my opinion. Plenty of folks have been able to make the on use trinkets work very well for them (ie your mileage may vary).


I completely agree with you about on-use trinkets Tinder. That said, I will probably get Kiroptyric Sigil next week just to help with dps on Ultraxion. I currently have the 384 Matrix and the 391 Hungerer. Swapping the Kiroptyric Sigil for the Hungerer simmed as a 705dps up in Mew with my current gear (it will be less on Ultraxion as I was simming a Shred fight, but still decent). At this point, any extra dps on that fight will be welcome (that or I will simply break my raid group into two 10 man teams and faceroll it). I really hate the idea of spending valor on a trinket that will be replaced shortly, especially since the neck and relic are both BiS and will never be replaced in this tier, but progression uber alles.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Laurind » Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:04 pm

don't "buy" it, justo borrow it... you have 2 hs to return it, and then buy it again
:D

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Leafkiller » Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:21 pm

As a side note, the 2 piece T13 has good synergy with the Kiroptyric Sigil. On a fight like Ultraxioon, you will get two Berserks. With the 90 second cooldown, you will berserk once at the start of the fight, and then your next opportunity is either around 3 minutes or 4:30. Given a kill time of under 5 minutes in a 10 man team, that will quickly become the 3 minute mark, where most likely Ultraxion will still have more than 40% of his life left. 2 piece T13, gives you the ability to use the 3 minute berserk while in the blood in the water phase, which makes the on-use trinkets easier to use optimally.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Puna » Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:34 pm

I was actually considering the trinket for Heroic Spine. Currently the tendons (for us) are about 2:30min apart so berserk isn't up for the second one. but with the trinket you could zerk+trinket the first, pot/trinket the second, and zerk/trinket the 3rd. If heroic goes just a wee bit slower its going to sync up very nicely with tendons. It will be a good investment for any omgkillitnow fights.

Bursting Hagaraa when shes stunned comes to mind as well.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Evil » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:04 am

What do you guys think about our Kitty Offset-Piece? What I was checking so far it would be Shoulders, right? Or any other opinion, I may overlook something.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Puna » Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:41 pm

Yes, shoulders will be the offset item this tier.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby soultakerro » Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:08 pm

Hey guys i was wondering how can i emprove my dps,
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/a ... rro/simple
here is armory i dont know how to use world of logs...

Just change glyph from savage roar to berserk,u can look at my talents and glyphs and let me know what i can change.
On item i dont know what else i can get exept the trinket from new dungeons the one from end time i did 7/8 new bosses but havent had much luck with items exept 2x tier,btw what will be the best combination for tier set i mean 4x and what slot should i leave free for a non set item,also what stats should i be loocking when loocking for new items,is it someting like with haster>hit>expertise>mastery ? what about crit,is there there a cap or should i just pic out items with hit and haster or any combination of haste hit expertise and mastery seams to me crit is not so good this days,atm i was playing with hit and expertise but thinking of chngeing to a haste spec,what caps should i have for a haste spec? and what about crit cap ,is there one what is a nice crit chance? and my rotation is i start with berserk and trinket for crit i use savage roar at 5 points than rake shread and rip at 5points,with a druid tank i dont usualy use mangle,after that i 5points ferocius bite,btw is it better with ferocius bite or shread? seams with 2 x t13 set bonus better fb than i just keep the bleeds up and fb when extra points come along...thats about all i can think of let me know guys i really want to improve

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:02 pm

Hi Soultakerro. Welcome to the community.

If you don't have any logs it is hard to tell you in specific what you can improve as we don't know what you are doing. We can give you some pointers to information already on the site.

here is armory i dont know how to use world of logs...

World of logs is a website that will take your combat log and parse it into readable results. Here is a link to a tour of the site. If your guild is not already running WOL you can set it up yourself.
http://www.worldoflogs.com/tour/live/

Just change glyph from savage roar to berserk,u can look at my talents and glyphs and let me know what i can change.

Your talents are fine. You are lucky your guild never asks you to interrupt.

On item i dont know what else i can get exept the trinket from new dungeons the one from end time i did 7/8 new bosses but havent had much luck with items exept 2x tier,

If you call getting your 2p on the first raid week of a new instance unlucky, I can't wait to see what you think of as lucky. Having 2p you should be able to swap the bloodletting glyph out for TF now if you feel you can hit TF on cooldown. Bloodletting won't be useful for most of the fight now that you have 2p.

btw what will be the best combination for tier set i mean 4x and what slot should i leave free for a non set item,also what stats should i be loocking when loocking for new items

If you look at the post right above you Puna answers that very question.

what about crit,is there there a cap or should i just pic out items with hit and haster or any combination of haste hit expertise and mastery seams to me crit is not so good this days,atm i was playing with hit and expertise but thinking of chngeing to a haste spec,what caps should i have for a haste spec?

At the end of Wrath because of an unexpected tier and with the addition of "Heroic" gear kitties were able to hit a crit cap. In Cata you will never be able to get enough crit to hit that mark. So no crit cap. Right now you should try and keep Mastery/Haste/Crit around the same levels. Do not try and make one much higher then the other two. Getting hit/exp cap is up to you.

and my rotation is i start with berserk and trinket for crit i use savage roar at 5 points than rake shread and rip at 5points,with a druid tank i dont usualy use mangle,after that i 5points ferocius bite,btw is it better with ferocius bite or shread? seams with 2 x t13 set bonus better fb than i just keep the bleeds up and fb when extra points come along...thats about all i can think of let me know guys i really want to improve

Are you using Leafkillers Ovale script? For someone learning the rotation it is a VERY valuable tool. Have a read of this thread (also a sticky) http://fluiddruid.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=620

Hope that helps.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby soultakerro » Wed Dec 07, 2011 9:08 am

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/o8uw ... details/8/ here are the logs from last night deathwing w25man

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Evil » Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:05 am

Just a short question. Have 4-T12 HC Set and got the Hand-Token (397) and have gooten via LFR the Head and Chest - Token. So my question would be - worth droping the 4 T12 HC Bonus for 2 T12 HC and 2 T13 (Normal / LFR) bonus?

And if so - what should I change - Chest (384) or Head (384)?

I'm not sure if it worth droping the 4 T12 HC Bonus for one normal and one lfr T13 token. Any opinions would be appricated.

Thanks.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Ledgeby » Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:08 pm

I've noticed you guys saying to keep all 3 secondary stats (not hit/exp ofc) as close together as possible, just wondering how you guys calculate that for reforging?

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby mekell » Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:33 pm

Use wowreforge.com and set the stat weights for those 3 stats to the same value. Leave hit/exp caps and make sure the value for those stats is 0 for the "over the cap weight".

THat will result in hitting the exp/hit cap and then using the remaining budget to equally distribute (as much as your gear's itemizations allow it) the rest to crit, haste and mastery.
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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Tinderhoof » Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:03 pm

soultakerro wrote:http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/o8uw2fzale0ad0pq/details/8/ here are the logs from last night deathwing w25man

Hi Soul.

I didn't get back to you before because I was hoping I could see logs from a kill or maybe a second week of attempts. The issue with looking at DPS logs from a fight that isn't a kill is it's hard to tell what went wrong and when. Plus I don't know which attempt is the one you did best at (that would be the one I would review).

If you have any logs from this week for me to look at I would be happy to go through them. Are you using Ovale and Leafkillers script?

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Dohtem » Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:51 am

Hey guys, first time poster and a new reader to the community :)
Was hoping to get some reactions and thoughts to my current setup.

I don't have any logs to post, since my guild's not raiding atm. But i like to be all i can be, in heroics and LFR's. I usually do fine, and with Leafkillers script on Ovale i've gotten a static DPS of around 18-19K.

Armoy: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/r ... m/advanced - Eu - Ragnaros - Dohtem

I've tried using Wowreforge.com to optimze my gear, but without knowing my current stat-weights (Mew doesnt work these days?) its not easy. (Maybe i can just enter "1" on crit, haste, mast?)

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Rarge » Wed Dec 14, 2011 11:20 am

Dohtem wrote:I've tried using Wowreforge.com to optimze my gear, but without knowing my current stat-weights (Mew doesnt work these days?) its not easy. (Maybe i can just enter "1" on crit, haste, mast?)


RSVs are disabled by default because people kept misinterpreting them.
If you really want them you can enable them by ticking "Generate relative stat values" in the Model Parameters section

As for your gear, it seems okay just a couple gemming issues I have:
With your belt why do you have a blue gem in the prismatic socket? 20 Agi > 20 Hit
Then in your legs you've put a red gem in the blue socket. When you'd be better of putting a blue gem in the blue socket as it has a +20 agi bonus.
Last edited by Rarge on Wed Dec 14, 2011 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby Dohtem » Wed Dec 14, 2011 1:37 pm

Rarge wrote:
Dohtem wrote:I've tried using Wowreforge.com to optimze my gear, but without knowing my current stat-weights (Mew doesnt work these days?) its not easy. (Maybe i can just enter "1" on crit, haste, mast?)


RSVs are disabled by default because people kept misinterpreting them.
If you really want them you can enable them you can tick "Generate relative stat values" in the Model Parameters section

As for your gear, it seems okay just a couple gemming issues I have:
With your belt why do you have a blue gem in the prismatic socket? 20 Agi > 20 Hit
Then in your legs you've put a red gem in the blue socket. When you'd be better of putting a blue gem in the blue socket as it has a +20 agi bonus.



Thanks man, i thought it was something with my java, or browser. As for the gemming, the belt was way older than my pants. Needed that particular gem at the time and my other pants had a similar gem. Didnt re-gem my old gear :-)

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Re: Let's talk about logs (Gearing and Execution advise) 4.3

Postby soultakerro » Wed Dec 14, 2011 6:54 pm

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/vftq7ou7lq0ilvwu/ got new wrist after raid lol..umm here are logs from tonight

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