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Gemming For Cata Bear

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Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Goodmongo » Wed Dec 22, 2010 3:49 pm

I'm wondering what the best advice on gemming for bears is. In warth stamina was the only gem you ever really wanted. I know things changed in Cata but is there any good advice and math on what to do? Does the socket bonus dicate what we gem? And how and were does dodge/mastery fit into the gemming spectrum?

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Tinderhoof » Wed Dec 22, 2010 7:49 pm

***********THIS THREAD WAS NECRO'D BY A SPAM BOT. ALL INFORMATION IN THIS POST IS LONG OUT OF DATE. PLEASE IGNORE.*************
I don't have specific math on this, but from my experience here is the following:
- You still need 1 red and 2 blue gems to active the new meta gem. Using a agi/stam gem will work on this.
- Blue slots pure stam gems, Red slots agi/stam gems, Yellow slots Agi/Mastery (only if the socket bonus is really good like 30 agility) or pure stam.
- Reforge every piece of haste you can into dodge.
- Don't gem for dodge, hit or expertise. As there isn't anymore parry haste expertise isn't as importent as it used to be. Its still a great stat, just not as good to gem for. Same for hit and dodge. You are likely going to get enough from your gear and Agi/Stam gems will get you more bang for your buck.
- Up to a point dodge trinkets are not as bad as they used to be. Right now we are not yet hitting DR on dodge, so a dodge trinket will give you a useful stat and usually a decent proc.

Check out http://eaoexcursions.wordpress.com/ . There is also a link to it on the fluiddruid.net main page. They have done a lot of detailed work around this question.
***********THIS THREAD WAS NECRO'D BY A SPAM BOT. ALL INFORMATION IN THIS POST IS LONG OUT OF DATE. PLEASE IGNORE.*************

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby shinryu » Tue Dec 27, 2011 2:12 am

Shame the NHL just ain't that popular spambot...

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Toro » Tue Dec 27, 2011 3:32 pm

So, in terms of stam, from what I've checked with a little math (which I don't have with me at work), just keep doing what was hot in 4.2:

Don't stack stam. Agi > Stam in almost all cases. The stamina added to being in bear form is to help correct the issues with my little 165k HP bear compete with a 200k HP pally from taking the major hits in heroic modes in Firelands when we didn't have shield up (t13 helps with this as well), but at the end of the day, our ability to put up a shield is still the biggest thing to us.

Agi is only slightly higher than dodge, atm. Stamina is somewhere down the list due to, and not limited to, our 18:24::phys:magic dmg reduction. We have quite a bit, it helps, and means our large pool of health won't be so easily depleted, but take into account added reduction in dmg from Savage Defense and those numbers aren't so big.

You want that high pool of attack power, and the bonus from Vengeance just doesn't compare to Agi stacking. Point for point, having HP to take a large hit vs the ability to take a smaller chunk of that hit... take the lesser dmg, imo! The t13-2pc makes this more consistant.

We're lucky atm with almsot all of the gems to get socket bonuses are reds, meaning more agi in place ~_* You only need two yellow gems to activate the stam+%armor meta, so it's pretty easy to just chuck in two agi/dodge gems.

Any stat that isn't mastery should go to dodge, when reforging your gear. Dodge is higher, but given typical gear giving 2 secondary stats, mastery will be better than the other secondary stat found on our Agi-based gear.

I'ma take a second and look at that link that Tinder put up... not finding all that much on tanking atm, but I could look at it more later.

TL;DR: Not just trying to go against Tinder, but from my personal findings and overall testing, agi is still the best way to go.
It's 106 mile to Chicago, we have a full tank of gas, a half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses... hit it!

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Toro » Tue Dec 27, 2011 3:45 pm

Also going to add to this: remember that not all people clearing the content are doing it in the "best" light.

This is most noted when people are pushing for new content when they're "undergeared" so that they can, not so much have an edge, but make things easier for what they're working with, as opposed to what would naturally be easier with time/gear.

ie that Paragon bear who finished t11 content straight stacking stam so he could take a hit. Even he made a statement that it's not best, but they needed it to be that way to complete content faster.

Atm, or so I've read and discussed with guildies and others, bears and DKs are the best largely on account of output and a shield that absorbs physical dmg. I will state that, based on single target logs, the damage is pretty linear across all tanks, but those stackable shields are amazing.

Edit: Removed "both magic and" from the section referring to the mastery shield for bears/dks.
Last edited by Toro on Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Tinderhoof » Tue Dec 27, 2011 4:05 pm

This thread got necro'd by a spam bot. The post you see that I made is almost exactly a year old (ie 3 weeks after Cata offcially hit). Stuff has changed a LOT and most of what I said above is VERY out of date.

Back when I made that post Bears were still bugged depending which spec you were in when 4.0 was released. You either had great damage and were squishy, or had crappy damage and were so so damage wise. Even the meta requirements changed (thank god). Going to update the first post so others arn't confused.

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Tinderhoof » Tue Dec 27, 2011 4:12 pm

Toro wrote:Atm, or so I've read and discussed with guildies and others, bears and DKs are the best largely on account of output and a shield that absorbs both magic and physical dmg. I will state that, based on single target logs, the damage is pretty linear across all tanks, but those stackable shields are amazing.

This is not true. Both DK and Bear Mastery "absorbs" are physical ONLY.
They do not absorbe magic damage. Magic damage is handled exactly the same across other tanks (not counting cooldowns). Only Stam (ie health), Resistance, and specific talents (Perservience, Natural Reaction) have any involvment in how magic damage is taken or reduced.

This is not to say that Bears and DK's are at a disadvantage. Right now Bears are VERY powerful and have the best passive damage reduection, health, and armor. DK's have always had the best cooldowns when related to Magic damage which is amazing for fights like Ultraxion and Yor'sahj.

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Re: Gemming For Cata Bear

Postby Toro » Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:20 pm

My apologies for not looking at the dates; I should have paid more attention to the NHL post that was above mine...

As for physical and magical dmg, I know it says physical, and that's all fine and dandy, but I did have to look into what the damage coming at my character was when I get those nice discolored aborbs: turns out they're specials with primarily physical damage, and albeit it shows absorb 'magic' the magic damage goes through and it lists the amount of the physical damage that is absorbed. My apologies for not separating the two initially.

The rest of that post should hold up!
It's 106 mile to Chicago, we have a full tank of gas, a half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark, and we're wearing sunglasses... hit it!

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